String Task

chalker
Member
Member
Posts: 2107
Joined: January 9th, 2009, 7:30 pm
Division: Grad
State: OH
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 56 times

Re: String Task

Post by chalker »

mattravn wrote:I had a question on the string task being connected to another task.

At our recent invitational, the judge said that for our setup where one pulls the string and as you pull the string it raises a cup that then tips to pour the material into the higher cup (task 4j) that since we are pulling the string and pouring the material at the same time that it could be considered a parallel task or a non-autonomous device. Please clarify if you think the described design is or is not allowed.

I have sent the question to the national site and will post if I get a reply. I suspect we will move to a counterweight sytem to pull the cup up in any case unless I happen to hear back in the next week or two from the national site.

Thanks as always for the input.

Matt
Unofficially, the way I'd look at this is with regards to rule 4 that says that a single action must contribute to only one scoreable task. So does the pulling of the string count towards the start task or task j? I can't contribute to both.

Student Alumni
National Event Supervisor
National Physical Sciences Rules Committee Chair
mattravn
Member
Member
Posts: 21
Joined: November 16th, 2011, 8:27 pm
Division: B
State: IL
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: String Task

Post by mattravn »

chalker wrote:
mattravn wrote:I had a question on the string task being connected to another task.

At our recent invitational, the judge said that for our setup where one pulls the string and as you pull the string it raises a cup that then tips to pour the material into the higher cup (task 4j) that since we are pulling the string and pouring the material at the same time that it could be considered a parallel task or a non-autonomous device. Please clarify if you think the described design is or is not allowed.

I have sent the question to the national site and will post if I get a reply. I suspect we will move to a counterweight sytem to pull the cup up in any case unless I happen to hear back in the next week or two from the national site.

Thanks as always for the input.

Matt
Unofficially, the way I'd look at this is with regards to rule 4 that says that a single action must contribute to only one scoreable task. So does the pulling of the string count towards the start task or task j? I can't contribute to both.
Thanks Chalker, definately move to a counterweight then. I'll post if I get a response from National.
Flavorflav
Member
Member
Posts: 1388
Joined: February 5th, 2006, 7:06 am
Division: Grad
State: NY
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: String Task

Post by Flavorflav »

foreverphysics wrote:Yes, as long as it doesn't stick out of the box at all, because it sounds like that in your design, you need it either close to the outside of the box or actually outside the box. So just make sure that it doesn't stick out at all; otherwise, you get second-tiered.
You'd only be second-tiered if it sticks out at the beginning. If it goes outside when you pull it, that's a 50 point penalty but you'd still be in the first tier.
mattravn
Member
Member
Posts: 21
Joined: November 16th, 2011, 8:27 pm
Division: B
State: IL
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: String Task

Post by mattravn »

Flavorflav wrote:
foreverphysics wrote:Yes, as long as it doesn't stick out of the box at all, because it sounds like that in your design, you need it either close to the outside of the box or actually outside the box. So just make sure that it doesn't stick out at all; otherwise, you get second-tiered.
You'd only be second-tiered if it sticks out at the beginning. If it goes outside when you pull it, that's a 50 point penalty but you'd still be in the first tier.
I would be tempted to agree and set it up such that when you pull the pin, you do it in a direction that keeps it in the box (i.e. you pull the string lightly which removes the pin that can just drop to the floor of the box). That way you don't have to worry about judges interpretation of if the pin leaving the box constitutes a violation or not.

We are doing something like this for a counterweight where the pin and the weight are completely in the box and when we pull the string the pin will remain inside the box.
GoNerdHerd
Exalted Member
Exalted Member
Posts: 56
Joined: April 10th, 2010, 7:31 am
Division: B
State: MI
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: String Task

Post by GoNerdHerd »

Our device has a piece of wood extending out of the main structure/box but it still remains in the 50 x 50 x 80 boundary. Would this be okay? I read the rules and I see no reason why it wouldn't be allowed, but I still want to clarify it.
2010 Regionals
1st Dynamic Planet
4th Meteorology
8th Can't Judge A Powder

2011 Regionals
2nd Meteorology
5th Compute This
6th Battery Buggy

2012 Regionals
1st Meteorology
4th Disease Detectives
5th Awesome Aquifers
mattravn
Member
Member
Posts: 21
Joined: November 16th, 2011, 8:27 pm
Division: B
State: IL
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: String Task

Post by mattravn »

mattravn wrote:I had a question on the string task being connected to another task.

At our recent invitational, the judge said that for our setup where one pulls the string and as you pull the string it raises a cup that then tips to pour the material into the higher cup (task 4j) that since we are pulling the string and pouring the material at the same time that it could be considered a parallel task or a non-autonomous device. Please clarify if you think the described design is or is not allowed.

I have sent the question to the national site and will post if I get a reply. I suspect we will move to a counterweight sytem to pull the cup up in any case unless I happen to hear back in the next week or two from the national site.

Thanks as always for the input.

Matt
I did get a reply that the above does violate the rules. Counterweight idea worked great.
mnstrviola
Wiki/Gallery Moderator Emeritus
Wiki/Gallery Moderator Emeritus
Posts: 433
Joined: February 15th, 2011, 5:45 pm
Division: Grad
State: CA
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: String Task

Post by mnstrviola »

So then what would you think if you did the pull string to pulley system with an IMA >1? Is that the same concept and therefore against the rules?
Locked

Return to “Mission Possible B”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest