Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by fleet130 » March 26th, 2009, 9:54 pm

DeltaHat wrote:I don't fully understand why there isn't room in SO for both mission and JYC.
There are still quite a few people active at the national level that feel there are too many building events.

The technology committee is limited to 4 different events in each division. In order to have Mission & JYC at the same time, one of the other events would have to be dropped. I don't believe you will ever see both Mission & JYC at the same time in the same division. If many had their way you would never see either one!

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Information expressed here is solely the opinion of the author. Any similarity to that of the management or any official instrument is purely coincidental! Doing Science Olympiad since 1987!

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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by DeltaHat » March 27th, 2009, 7:12 am

Fleet,
I agree. It would be nice if JYC and mission alternated divisions. Run JYC/C and Mission/B for three years, then switch to Mission/C and JYC/B for three years.

I don't like the current schedule of running JYC/C once, JYC/B once (possibly), and then shelving the event.
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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by Flavorflav » March 27th, 2009, 7:35 am

I feel like JYC may have benefited from another year as a trial event, if only to overcome the hostility towards it and to streamline the challenge descriptions. I think that if it returns it is very important to have all necessary rules included in the booklet. Apparently, the complexity of the event and especially the necessity of consulting the internet threw a number of people for a loop. We may find that silly, but it seem to have been a fact.

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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by fleet130 » March 27th, 2009, 10:18 am

No amount of testing/trials can overcome the "hostility" toward Mission & JYC (Wright Stuff and Robots are in the same category). People are against the concept, not how the rules are written or how the event is run. They just don't see any "science value" in these events.

The original rotation schedule had each event for in for 3 years, but it was changed to 2-year before the schedule was adopted. According to the plan, events start out in Division C for 2 years, move to Division B for 2 years and then are out for 2 years. This means that most competitors would not see the same event return before they graduate.

The rotation schedule got out of whack, on 2 occasions, because it was not followed (I'm sure this is one of the reasons the process for selecting events was changed). To get back on track, an event had to be scheduled for only 1 year instead of 2.

Another goal has been to have the same events in both Division B and Division C at the same time (e.g. Elevated Bridge). The purpose is to reduce the necessary people and resources and to make managing the rules easier.

Note that the 2 plans conflict, so you should expect to see some hybrid. If the past is any indication, the "rotation" may disappear when the wind changes direction!
Information expressed here is solely the opinion of the author. Any similarity to that of the management or any official instrument is purely coincidental! Doing Science Olympiad since 1987!

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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by Flavorflav » March 28th, 2009, 8:43 am

I was actually thinking more about hostility from below. When I first heard about this event, I thought it was a nightmare. Over time I began to appreciate its potential. It turned out to actually be a nightmare at States because the judges had some, shall we say, "creative" interpretations of the rules, but I think it could be a good event. I suspect that if you polled coaches, however, it would rank on the very bottom, well below its nearest competitor.

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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by DeltaHat » March 30th, 2009, 4:07 pm

I don't know if spending another year as a trial would have worked. Trial events just don't get the level of attention they need to work the bugs out. The event supervisors for trial events are almost never qualified enough, and the teams that participate are almost never prepared, if they participate at all. I have heard som true horror stories about JYC as a trial event and they all start with an unqualified judge or an unprepared team.

Even now that the even is running live, teams still show up unprepared for the event and some judges still make wild assumptions about the event mechanics.
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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by jazzy009 » March 30th, 2009, 4:18 pm

at our state comp we had some fun...
we were one of the few teams who built the coin sorter to 1m tall (99cm...close) and when it was our turn to run the coin sorter, hand fed for state, they informed us that the sorter would be on a table...NOT on the ground. My teammate stood on a chair to feed the coins in. Did anyone else experience this? i didnt think it was required to have the sorter on a table...otherwise whats the point of building it 1m high!? we still got 4th even with a penalty. i dont think minnesota prepared for that event
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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by maggymay » March 30th, 2009, 9:09 pm

Event supervisors have a lot of power over their event, no matter what it is. It could even be said that they sometimes don't seem to quite know the rules...I know of one person where their event supervisor(not JYC) tried to say their built device was somehow too tall. This particular Olympian knew the event rules VERY well and said to the event-supervisor "show me where it says *that* in the rules". They nicely :D backed the supervisor down.

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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by jazzy009 » March 31st, 2009, 4:16 am

yeah we appealed like civil students but they wouldnt have it. didnt like our knowledge apparently or for some reason they liked the table too much
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Re: Next Year's Junkyard Challenge

Post by sean9keenan » March 31st, 2009, 5:08 am

I figured I would post this over anywhere else. I've been working on this event, and have actually come to like it a lot more then I had expected. The only thing that we were talking about that we thought might be a cool idea (although maybe impossible to actually do) would be to run the alternate Junkyard challenge as a trial event. I feel like it would be really interesting, and would definitely make our efforts seem a lot less wasted... plus alternates could perhaps enter in with the device... The actual organization of something like this would be rather difficult, but I think it would be a lot of fun, and worthwhile if it could be pulled off...

Thoughts?
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