Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 22nd, 2017, 6:08 am

It's about two weeks before N.Y State Scioly competition and still no word about Mystery Design. Does anyone know what we are doing? If anyone knows, that would be really helpful. Thank you :?: :ugeek: .
I think the best bet is to keep checking the webpage. It would be great if they could send an email to the coaches - which shouldn't be too hard, since we all had to register on Ezra - but I'm not holding my breath. I think it's likely that they're waiting until the last minute, since the last regional tournament was this past weekend, and they wouldn't want to release it until all State teams are registered (checks due this Friday), for the sake of fairness.
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 24th, 2017, 11:45 am

http://www.newyorkscioly.org/wp-content ... States.pdf

This looks like an extremely thin premise to go with - what is the "toy" that's specified?
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 24th, 2017, 12:13 pm

http://www.newyorkscioly.org/wp-content ... States.pdf

This looks like an extremely thin premise to go with - what is the "toy" that's specified?
http://www.newyorkscioly.org/wp-content ... he-Toy.pdf Still pretty thin ... but I guess this is better. Maybe a more coherent document will be posted.
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby Beyaffe » March 24th, 2017, 12:50 pm

So we FINALLY got the specifications for Mystery Design, but it's extremely vague. Does anyone have any design ideas? How exactly are we supposed to use paper to make a chair?
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 24th, 2017, 1:01 pm

So we FINALLY got the specifications for Mystery Design, but it's extremely vague. Does anyone have any design ideas? How exactly are we supposed to use paper to make a chair?
Yeah, this was pretty disappointing. I sent an email to the director with this list of questions -

1. Will the students be allowed to bring scissors, will they be provided, or are students expected to only use their hands to modify the papers provided?

2. Rule 5 says "the frame can be lifted without breaking" - Does this imply that the entire structure must be lifted, or that the frame needs to be removable from the legs? Essentially, do the students need to build and design one single structure, or can there be separate pieces?

3. Rule 6 says "the floor will span the entire inside area of the triangular frame" - I'm not seeing what's the purpose of the floor - can the students just lay a piece of paper flat and put their legs/frame on top of it? This makes me think the floor needs to be attached.

4. Rule 8 about the extremities - will the students be placing the toy on the structure, or will the supervisors be doing this? The "no matter the orientation" clause seems to imply that the ES will test various orientations. Also, what is the toy? The specs are not particularly helpful. A picture would be useful; a link to Amazon so teams can buy their own toy for testing would be better.

5. Is there a scoring rubric beyond what was posted from the Wisconsin rules on the website?

6. What is the source for the paper and tape (so the students can generate an items cost list)?
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby Riku » March 28th, 2017, 10:11 am

Did you ever hear a response from the email you sent the director?

What I am most confused about is rules 3 and 4.

3. The frame will consist of three sides that make form an equilateral triangle.

4. Each side will measure at least 20 cm.


Does that mean there will need to be three walls made in the shape of a triangle with one sheet of paper acting as the floor?

Also, I assume that "Each side will measure at least 20 cm" means that the triangle frame needs to be 20 cm on each side. If that is the case, rule 8 is impossible to follow. "None of the toy’s extremities will touch the frame, no matter the orientation of the toy". If the toy is 23 cm from head to toy as they say, if will have to touch the walls of the frame. There is no other way to fit.

I am not sure if I may be reading this incorrectly, or maybe someone else has the same questions.

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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 28th, 2017, 10:43 am

Did you ever hear a response from the email you sent the director?

What I am most confused about is rules 3 and 4.

3. The frame will consist of three sides that make form an equilateral triangle.

4. Each side will measure at least 20 cm.


Does that mean there will need to be three walls made in the shape of a triangle with one sheet of paper acting as the floor?

Also, I assume that "Each side will measure at least 20 cm" means that the triangle frame needs to be 20 cm on each side. If that is the case, rule 8 is impossible to follow. "None of the toy’s extremities will touch the frame, no matter the orientation of the toy". If the toy is 23 cm from head to toy as they say, if will have to touch the walls of the frame. There is no other way to fit.

I am not sure if I may be reading this incorrectly, or maybe someone else has the same questions.
No reply yet ... there's definitely a lot of room for interpretation. The scoring rubric, that was provided with the Wisconsin rules that have been up for a while, is vague also, as to how the points are divided up.

As for the triangle, my interpretation is that the toy should only sit on the 3 legs, without touching the frame - meaning that the frame doesn't extend all the way to the top? It's not much of a stool or chair ... Weird event. Keeping my fingers crossed for clarification. The coaches' meeting Friday night will be after Mystery Design impound anyway.
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 28th, 2017, 11:14 am

I don't think it would be giving too much away to share the prototype my students made; it resembles a group of bowling pins (6 of them instead of 10), where each "pin" is a tightly rolled cylinder. The pins are organized into rows of 3-2-1, making a triangle, that can be surrounded by the "frame" - just strips of paper. Fortunately, 3m of tape is pretty generous, and with a straight edge, it's not impossible to double the length by tearing it into 1/2" wide strips.
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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby drcubbin » March 28th, 2017, 1:32 pm

Yes, an Amazon link for the Mystery Design toy would be helpful :)

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Re: Mystery Design B [TRIAL]

Postby SPP SciO » March 29th, 2017, 11:20 am

http://www.newyorkscioly.org/wp-content ... elines.pdf So this was posted today - I can't be the only one totally baffled by this event - this seems to imply that there are only 34 points in the entire event?

The only factor to differentiate teams is the time to completion factor. The structure actually working is worth 1 point. Imagine two teams with identical scores. Team A finishes 4 minutes faster than Team B, but Team A's structure does not hold the required weight. Team A would still win with this scenario.

The original rules specified 72 points for part 1, and 130 points for part 2. These scoring parameters suggest 20 points for part 1, and 14 points for part 2. Am I missing something?
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