National Test Discussion

Jaol
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National Test Discussion

Postby Jaol » Sat May 20, 2017 10:30 pm

Ayyy let's goooooo. Since the tourney is done, let's start this thread back up again. Always a useful thread I think.

1. State your event, provide commentary negative and positive. Grade it on a scale that you wish. I believe that this is a useful thread for the test writers and a useful platform to call out or praise writers or proctors.

WIDI C: I'm the doer, so based on what I did and what my partner said afterwards, it was a fairly simple widi, but with a couple of interesting twists. 6/10. (Does anyone know what the metal piece on the left side was? The one with the straw and the nut?)

Invasive Species C: Overdone on ID I think. Fairly straightforward test however, with no suuuper confusing questions. I believe it was based heavily on last year's test. 5/10
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby Trohans » Sun May 21, 2017 3:11 am

Bottle Rocket B- They were expecting bad weather so everyone had to go before 10:00. We got there at 5:45 and didn't launch until 7 because people claimed they had 7 o'clock events and had to go first. It turns out at 2:15, our designated launch time, it was sunny and warm with no wind . The 10 minute rule wasn't applied and the inspection was quick and not thorough. This might have been fine for an invitational but definitely not Nationals 3/10

Road Scholar B- This test was amazing. By far the best Road test I have ever taken. It was funny and creative and really tested your knowledge, separating the good teams from the rest of the competition. The only negative thing I have to say is that it was a long test (which can be good) but most teams still had a few questions left when time ran out. The Event Supervisors obviously knew what they were doing and were very helpful 9/10

WIDI B- The test was very nicely run and the ES's were very helpful. They made sure everyone had the same pieces and they screened off all the windows into the rooms. They taped off the area to avoid people from coming and eavesdropping. The model didn't have many parts but each piece was worth many points and they were mostly intricately placed. There were three rooms which they rotated through each block so that the model wouldn't have to be moved to be scored. Even if the model wasn't extremely difficult, the test was very well organized and executed and the rules were followed well, which is rare in WIDI 7/10

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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby sciolyFTW_aku » Sun May 21, 2017 3:38 am

Hi,

A+P (6): Nice and legitimate except for the BAC part, which was more like a health final than part of an anatomy test. 8/10

MM (30): Good, hard test but no industrial processes; I didn't really study/work/try so bad. 8/10

HV (6): Test had good questions and was varied. My partner did poorly on the test, but I did pretty well on the build (1988g, 19.67s) so yay. 9/10

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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby Zioly » Sun May 21, 2017 4:03 am

Bottle rockets (5) C. Poorly run. Supervisors were unclear in what defined the cracking of an egg. Their reasoning caused me (and others) to be tiered. Thankfully, I appealed and i got a medal! Agreed with Trohans.

Hovercraft (14) B. Test was excellent with a good mix of easy and difficult problems, despite lacking in variety. I made this comment to the supervisors: don't ever let build trials be done in the test room. It's very distracting. I'm a little disappointed our craft hit 13 instead of the target 21, which it could have. 14th is still good though.

Ecology (9) A. A brilliant test, reminiscent of last years gg test, as I believe the tests were written by the same person.

Scrambler (20-something) A-. Nice judges and well run despite a slight hiccup at the start.

I'm a little disappointed I didn't medal twice, particularly in hovercraft, but I won my schools first national medal and in my favorite event after a nerve wracking appeal. I'm happy. Great tournament this year. Looking forward to next year!
2017 Nats Div. B
Bottle Rockets: 5th
Ecology: 9th
Hovercraft: 14th
Scrambler: 29th (with a failed run too ;))


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Ecology
Experimental Design (or other inquiry :P)

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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby John Richardsim » Sun May 21, 2017 4:42 am

When do we start asking chalker for scores?
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby ptabraham_nerd01 » Sun May 21, 2017 4:56 am

Anatomy (27): 7/10 Yeah, forgot a calculator... I didn't like the BAC questions. Most of the multiple choice were good except the questions that ask for the number of cells. I was pretty disappointed overall at my performance, but the test itself was pretty good.

Disease Detectives (15): 9/10 It was a little easier than normal, but I think I made some simple mistakes that probably bumped us back.

Remote Sensing (22): 10/10 Uhhhh... It was a really good test!!! Really happy with my placement considering I didn't focus on this event (left half the test blank)
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby sciolyFTW_aku » Sun May 21, 2017 9:11 pm

Sorry but I feel like my previous post's discussion about A+P wasn't through enough, so here we go:

Anatomy and Physiology (6th): Overall the one of the best tests I have taken this year. It was a mixture of easy and hard questions, and the first 95 questions were very much doable for a person like me who has read through multiple textbooks. However, it did focus heavily on the nervous system, with little about sense organs and the endocrine system. I feel like because the event is sponsored by the SfN, Brain Facts material was prevalent throughout the test (i.e the neurotoxin MPTP causes synthetically-induced Parkinson's). Needless to say, the next part was rather erratic. The treatments section may have been part of the rules, but some of the medications were too specific and most likely kept on the reference sheet rather than learned about. In addition to this, the BAC part of the test was bad. First of all, I am a rising junior but still haven't taken my permit test. So, it might be common knowledge to know the legal limit for alcoholic blood concentration? (oops I gave this section to my partner because it was trivial math) but IMO it conferred an advantage to the upperclassmen. There is no need to know this, as we are asked to study about the effects of alcohol on predominantly the CNS. Also, I should not have to learn this through a health class or something similar. Furthermore, may of the questions following this depended on this limit, and as my partner and I both did not know it we got the rest wrong, which may have cost us a higher placement. In addition, I felt they should have not given us the Nernst equation as it would have been known by someone who bothered to study about neuronal electrophysiology in detail (i.e Vander's), and made the section just trivial math as well. One more thing- the college deaths due to alcohol question was not even a good question. It had nothing to do with the event, and I don't know why you would have to know it. Some might argue that you have to know stuff outside of the rules (which I totally agree on) but this is just plain obscure and nonessential. However, the hypothyroidism case study was nice, and the tiebreaker questions were hard as well. Finally, the test might have seen long but really wasn't. I predominantly took the test, leaving my partner to only do the BAC part and some of the sparse and easy sense organ questions, and we were able to finish with a little bit of time to check our answers before time ran out. All in all, it was a very good test but slightly "jank" in a few places. 8/10
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby efeng » Sun May 21, 2017 10:33 pm

Disease Detectives B (1st place): Even though I was not at the national tournament last year, I took the test. I think that the test this year was easier, but only by a little bit. I was also somewhat surprised that the first section was not a foodborne illness, but instead a respiratory illness. However, I don't think this is a big deal, because nationals disease tests are all about the applications and the process of the investigation. Also, the second section had no math whatsoever. Other than that, it was good. Another thing that I heard from our Division C Team (Mounds View High School) said that the event proctor was giving out the formula for odds ratio and relative risk. Side note: the Division B room was REALLY nice. Extra points! 8/10

Mission Possible B (25th place): Our test run got perfect score, and by the time we set up, we had 2 seconds left until the 30 minutes to set up was over. However, we didn't have time to go over our checklist, and ended up getting 500 points off (don't question it). RIP. The event supervisors and timers were pretty good, and the venue was pretty nice. 7/10
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2017 Nationals Disease Detectives 1st (Div B)
2018 Nationals WiFi Lab 3rd, Overall Team 5th (Div C)

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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby allopathie » Mon May 22, 2017 12:17 am

Ecology (7): 3/10, bad test overall. Most of the questions were too easy and could have been done by someone who picked up the event in the past week, and too much material from Green Gen. 5 or 6 of the questions tested miscellaneous or unlikely to be known knowledge, but likely were the determinant as to who placed top 10. Case in point: LASA, who placed 1st at MIT, got 41st in the event.
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby Adi1008 » Mon May 22, 2017 12:30 am

allopathie wrote:Case in point: LASA, who placed 1st at MIT, got 41st in the event.

Just to add on: not just 1st at MIT, but also 1st at Golden Gate (with competition like Troy and Mira Loma), 1st at UT Regionals, and 2nd at State
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby Unome » Mon May 22, 2017 12:32 am

Adi1008 wrote:
allopathie wrote:Case in point: LASA, who placed 1st at MIT, got 41st in the event.

Just to add on: not just 1st at MIT, but also 1st at Golden Gate (with competition like Troy and Mira Loma), 1st at UT Regionals, and 2nd at State

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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby dxu46 » Mon May 22, 2017 1:41 am

Trohans wrote:Road Scholar B- This test was amazing. By far the best Road test I have ever taken. It was funny and creative and really tested your knowledge, separating the good teams from the rest of the competition. The only negative thing I have to say is that it was a long test (which can be good) but most teams still had a few questions left when time ran out. The Event Supervisors obviously knew what they were doing and were very helpful 9/10

IKR? Our team didn't finish (only 1 more question!!!) but that was probably to differentiate places. If everyone finished, chances would be that we would go to the 3rd or 4th tiebreaker and it would be as complicated as MO hovercraft (the one that sent Wydown - 1st in that event - to nationals). Only complaint is that the maps weren't laminated, so you couldn't slide the azimuths around.

P.S. Trohans
Are you from Daniel Wright JHS? If so, congrats on the first place finish!!!

Edit: I heard from my friend that Scrambler was bad. It supposedly got delayed because the ES was playing Clash Royale on a phone (correct me if I'm wrong) and delayed the event by 2 hours. Also, our team got placed on a track with a dent on the floor, and...well...BOOM. What's sad is that it was a national level car. At States, it stopped less than a millimeter away from the barrier, and it could've done better!
Last edited by dxu46 on Mon May 22, 2017 1:50 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby superpenguin666 » Mon May 22, 2017 1:46 am

Ecology (3) -- A bit too easy for my liking, but a decent test nonetheless. The competition was split into 11 stations, with 4 minutes each, but to break ties, there were tiebreaker questions on the back. It was hard to decide whether or not to check over the actual station or work on the tiebreaker questions, but at the end, we managed to get both of them finished.
Grade: B+
Small fact: I pronounce Ecology like E-caw-logy.

Invasive Species (12) -- Good test, with fast stations (20, 2 minutes each, same as last year), but I'm particularly mad at my placement. I studied mainly for this event, and went into competition, and at the end, we we sure that we got about 90-95/100 of them. Last year, there were some specimens I wasn't sure about and some sketchy laws, but this year I knew all of the best methods of control for each Invasive, laws, vocab, ID, and how to work fast. But yet, I still got 12th (7th last year). This makes me wonder how this test was graded, as I know for sure the questions were hard enough that a 90 would definitely net top 3, maybe 1st (last year I got a 60/100, and still got 7th). If the grader only accepted exact answers, then this event is ran in the wrong way, as multiple answers should be accepted in a binder event, especially one of the ID events. Now, I'm not sure if I'm going to do Herpetology next year if it's a binder event, but we will see. :x
Grade: A for Test, F for Grading

Optics (36) -- Test was a bit too easy (why should I be saying this when I got such a low rank you might ask), but what tripped our team up was the Laser Shoot. Now, we practiced a lot, but we made one of the stupidest mistakes -- we draw a line, but forgot to put down the mirror :cry:. I don't understand why neither of us realized that, as we would've got 45-50 points (it perfectly follow the template and bounced off the barrier mirror before hitting the side wall) and instead got 20, and could possibly have jumped 20-25 places. But shoutout to my brother, for getting 1st place in C division Optics :D!
Grade: B

Since no one has asked for scores yet, I'll guess I'll start (sorry chalker, but I really want to know what happened in Invasives)!

Invasive Species -- How many points out of 100, points away from 6th, points away from 1st, how it was graded (possibly), and is Herpetology a binder event?
Ecology -- How many points out of total score, points away from 6th, points away from 1st.
Optics -- How many points out of total score, points away from 6th, points away from 1st. And how LHWHS did (same thing, excluding points away from 1st).
2017-2018 Season: Thermo :P , Ecology, Optics
Goals: Win nats in Optics and Thermo... wait a minute... :cry:
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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby efeng » Mon May 22, 2017 2:42 am

If we can start asking, I have questions only for Disease Detectives B

Disease Detectives B (1st place): How many points did we get, and how many points was it out of? What was the point difference between 1st and 2nd place? What was the point difference between 1st and 6th place? What was the point difference between 6th and 7th place?

I'd really appreciate it if you answered these questions. Thanks!
Mounds View HS, Minnesota

2017 Nationals Disease Detectives 1st (Div B)
2018 Nationals WiFi Lab 3rd, Overall Team 5th (Div C)

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Re: National Test Discussion

Postby chalker » Mon May 22, 2017 2:58 am

Hi all.. I don't know when, or even if, I'll get around to responding to questions. I was in committee meetings from ~8AM until 10:30PM today (Sunday) and have another full day tomorrow. As a result of these I have a lot of work to do on rules changes for next year, which will be my priority.

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