Experimental Design B/C

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kate!
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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby kate! » February 14th, 2018, 4:58 pm

Ethancheese123 wrote:So i just got this event. Any suggestions?


So basically what you should do is look on soinc.org so you can find the rubric! The rubric is what they grade with and it's really important that you have all of the components on it so you can get a better score. You definitely need to practice a lot for this event so you can get better at cooperating with your partners. I would suggest splitting up the rubric into sections so each person does 1 section. Everyone splits it up differently, for example, my teammates and I put all of the similar parts together and split it that way.
Just make sure you get practice in with different types of experiments and try to perfect your section of the work.
Last year I knew stuff about rocks, minerals, experiments, and ecosystems, yay!
Now I know stuff about amphibians, reptiles, water, and more experiments, yay again!
I'm planning to learn stuff about oceanography, fossils, water, and birds, yay for the third time!

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby n00batscioly » February 17th, 2018, 12:19 pm

What is Standard of Comparison in Experimental Control? I'm having trouble understanding what it is and this is the first time I've done it this year

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby n00batscioly » February 17th, 2018, 12:22 pm

Ethan and i are partners in crime (not in crime busters)

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby MissAmargasaurus » February 17th, 2018, 1:53 pm

n00batscioly wrote:What is Standard of Comparison in Experimental Control? I'm having trouble understanding what it is and this is the first time I've done it this year


The standard of comparison is basically what you're comparing the rest of the data to! It's a very easy section and then basic template is, "The SOC of the experiment is (lowest IV here), as it is the lowest level and easiest to compare to." Hope that helps you.
2016-17 Season: Experimental Design, Invasive Species, Wind Power, Forenics
2017-2018 Season: Experimental Design, Ecology, Herpetology
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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby dxu46 » February 17th, 2018, 1:58 pm

MissAmargasaurus wrote:
n00batscioly wrote:What is Standard of Comparison in Experimental Control? I'm having trouble understanding what it is and this is the first time I've done it this year


The standard of comparison is basically what you're comparing the rest of the data to! It's a very easy section and then basic template is, "The SOC of the experiment is (lowest IV here), as it is the lowest level and easiest to compare to." Hope that helps you.

The lowest IV level is not always a good idea. When the experiment is qualitative, then it is better to use a comparison-control, where you can compare each level to each other level.

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby MissAmargasaurus » February 17th, 2018, 2:01 pm

dxu46 wrote:
MissAmargasaurus wrote:
n00batscioly wrote:What is Standard of Comparison in Experimental Control? I'm having trouble understanding what it is and this is the first time I've done it this year


The standard of comparison is basically what you're comparing the rest of the data to! It's a very easy section and then basic template is, "The SOC of the experiment is (lowest IV here), as it is the lowest level and easiest to compare to." Hope that helps you.

The lowest IV level is not always a good idea. When the experiment is qualitative, then it is better to use a comparison-control, where you can compare each level to each other level.


Oh I'd agree with that, there's been issues before I've had due to that. However it does work a majority of the time I feel, and it helps to have a kind of base.

The SOC still is though basically a statement explaining what your control level is (this is part of the reason it's better to try to get 4 IV levels rather than 3 if possible) and then saying why, "easiest to compare to" suffices usually.
2016-17 Season: Experimental Design, Invasive Species, Wind Power, Forenics
2017-2018 Season: Experimental Design, Ecology, Herpetology
2018-2019 Season: Experimental Design, Fossils, Herpetology, Wright Stuff
I love reptiles and fossils! <3

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby mpnobivucyxtz » February 19th, 2018, 7:27 pm

What's the consensus on using abbreviations (like IV and SOC)? Not having to write them out would save time but I'm not sure how the graders would see it and I don't want to risk losing points.

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby SPP SciO » February 20th, 2018, 4:54 am

MissAmargasaurus wrote:
n00batscioly wrote:What is Standard of Comparison in Experimental Control? I'm having trouble understanding what it is and this is the first time I've done it this year


The standard of comparison is basically what you're comparing the rest of the data to! It's a very easy section and then basic template is, "The SOC of the experiment is (lowest IV here), as it is the lowest level and easiest to compare to." Hope that helps you.


I don't think there's a rule for choosing SOC that will apply every time - but I've been teaching my students this,

-If the IV is some sort of "treatment" then the SOC would be the group without treatment (simple control group). Imagine you're adding rubber bands to tennis balls for traction, and then rolling them to determine speed; the SOC would have zero rubber bands.
-If the IV is measurable and within your control, choose the SOC to be a round number in the middle - that way you can see the effects of both increasing it and decreasing it. For example, you've got string to make pendulums. The SOC length may be 30cm, while the other levels are 10, 20, 40 and 50.
-Don't record any "waste of time" data - for example a ramp with an incline of 0 or 90, or seeing if a sponge can absorb 0mL of water. It may seem like a good idea to be thorough, but there's no benefit to be had from the rubric.
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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby dxu46 » February 20th, 2018, 2:24 pm

mpnobivucyxtz wrote:What's the consensus on using abbreviations (like IV and SOC)? Not having to write them out would save time but I'm not sure how the graders would see it and I don't want to risk losing points.

Our team has always written them out and we've done pretty well at competitions, so I would assume they were okay. For SOC, I would write it out because I've seen people who do not know what the abbreviation is.

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby mpnobivucyxtz » February 20th, 2018, 9:55 pm

dxu46 wrote: Our team has always written them out and we've done pretty well at competitions, so I would assume they were okay.


I’m a bit confused on what you mean. Does that mean I shouldn’t abbreviate, or should I abbreviate for “obvious” things like DV and IV, but write out SOC?

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby mpnobivucyxtz » February 20th, 2018, 9:56 pm

I have a couple of other questions as well!

1. If our hypothesis isn’t supported, this doesn’t reflect poorly on us, right? Will a write up with an incorrect hypothesis / reasoning score lower than one with the same procedure / experiment, but with the right initial prediction?

2. In the analysis, am I allowed to provide reasoning for why our data was the way it was, even if we didn’t measure it / even if it’s speculation? For example, if we’re talking about a bouncing ball, can I explain that it bounced higher when dropped from a higher point because of impulse, even though we never directly measured the impulse? The rubric says “all statements must be supported by data” but I’m not sure whether that applies here.

3. What happens if you don’t have an outlier? Do you just state that in your analysis? How should this be worded?

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby Ambrosia » February 23rd, 2018, 12:30 pm

mpnobivucyxtz wrote:I have a couple of other questions as well!

1. If our hypothesis isn’t supported, this doesn’t reflect poorly on us, right? Will a write up with an incorrect hypothesis / reasoning score lower than one with the same procedure / experiment, but with the right initial prediction?

2. In the analysis, am I allowed to provide reasoning for why our data was the way it was, even if we didn’t measure it / even if it’s speculation? For example, if we’re talking about a bouncing ball, can I explain that it bounced higher when dropped from a higher point because of impulse, even though we never directly measured the impulse? The rubric says “all statements must be supported by data” but I’m not sure whether that applies here.

3. What happens if you don’t have an outlier? Do you just state that in your analysis? How should this be worded?


If your hypothesis isn't supported by the data it should be fine. That was something we were worried about too when it happened, but it shouldn't affect anything. We didn't get any points off. Just make sure to explain a possible reason why.

In terms of the analysis, sorry but I can't really help you with that. My partner does that section. However, you really should make sure to have an outlier in your data. It's much more convenient to be able to talk about it.

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby dxu46 » February 23rd, 2018, 4:06 pm

Ambrosia wrote:
mpnobivucyxtz wrote:I have a couple of other questions as well!

1. If our hypothesis isn’t supported, this doesn’t reflect poorly on us, right? Will a write up with an incorrect hypothesis / reasoning score lower than one with the same procedure / experiment, but with the right initial prediction?

2. In the analysis, am I allowed to provide reasoning for why our data was the way it was, even if we didn’t measure it / even if it’s speculation? For example, if we’re talking about a bouncing ball, can I explain that it bounced higher when dropped from a higher point because of impulse, even though we never directly measured the impulse? The rubric says “all statements must be supported by data” but I’m not sure whether that applies here.

3. What happens if you don’t have an outlier? Do you just state that in your analysis? How should this be worded?


If your hypothesis isn't supported by the data it should be fine. That was something we were worried about too when it happened, but it shouldn't affect anything. We didn't get any points off. Just make sure to explain a possible reason why.

In terms of the analysis, sorry but I can't really help you with that. My partner does that section. However, you really should make sure to have an outlier in your data. It's much more convenient to be able to talk about it.

I would advise against making up data - at state last year the event supervisors would tier any teams who faked data.

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby mpnobivucyxtz » February 23rd, 2018, 4:33 pm

dxu46 wrote: I would advise against making up data.


How would they know unless they see you not doing the experiment? What would you do in the case there are no outliers?

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Re: Experimental Design B/C

Postby dxu46 » February 24th, 2018, 11:18 am

mpnobivucyxtz wrote:
dxu46 wrote: I would advise against making up data.


How would they know unless they see you not doing the experiment? What would you do in the case there are no outliers?

The Event Supervisors in Missouri watch us. If you don't have an outlier, don't write about it.


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