Boomilever B/C

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby sciolyperson1 » January 14th, 2019, 1:17 pm

waffletree wrote:
TheChiScientist wrote:
MadCow2357 wrote:No such rule, what in the world happened?
Carrot wrote:Pretty sure that as long as the center of the loading block is within 40 to 45cm you should be good. If your boomi goes over 45cm but has the center of loading block within the range, you should not get tiered.

Upon further investigation and review by me, my partner, and other people that compete in Boomilever we have determined that UChicago has misinterpreted Section 3 Subsection C of the Boomilever rules and prematurely declared my Boomilever tiered! Furthermore, the UChicago ES failed to notify me that my Boomilever was within a "construction violation", thus I was unable to arbitrate and correct their improper tier... There WILL be an arbitration as multiple injustices were made to the competitors (me and my partner) and no opportunity was given for clarification or arbitration. :evil: :evil: :evil: This is not cool...

oof rip


Rule 4.II.j: "Teams who wish to file an appeal must leave their Boomilever with the event supervisor."

I'm sorry, but you really can't change much at this point.
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby TheChiScientist » January 14th, 2019, 1:39 pm

sciolyperson1 wrote:
waffletree wrote:
TheChiScientist wrote:Upon further investigation and review by me, my partner, and other people that compete in Boomilever we have determined that UChicago has misinterpreted Section 3 Subsection C of the Boomilever rules and prematurely declared my Boomilever tiered! Furthermore, the UChicago ES failed to notify me that my Boomilever was within a "construction violation", thus I was unable to arbitrate and correct their improper tier... There WILL be an arbitration as multiple injustices were made to the competitors (me and my partner) and no opportunity was given for clarification or arbitration. :evil: :evil: :evil: This is not cool...

oof rip


Rule 4.II.j: "Teams who wish to file an appeal must leave their Boomilever with the event supervisor."

I'm sorry, but you really can't change much at this point.

Not really but we can have the Boomilever scores thrown out and at least they won't make the same mistake on some poor Div B. kid this weekend at their Div B. invitational... :(
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby FermiGod » January 14th, 2019, 1:53 pm

TheChiScientist wrote:
sciolyperson1 wrote:
waffletree wrote:oof rip


Rule 4.II.j: "Teams who wish to file an appeal must leave their Boomilever with the event supervisor."

I'm sorry, but you really can't change much at this point.

Not really but we can have the Boomilever scores thrown out and at least they won't make the same mistake on some poor Div B. kid this weekend at their Div B. invitational... :(


in all honesty its pretty disappointing how you only care about your score and your placement based on a simple mistake the ES did. Just work on and improve your design for your next invite or competition. Don't stick your gut with something that happened 2 days ago.They put a lot of work into this invite and I wouldn't be that mad but just take it easy and chill.

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby TheChiScientist » January 14th, 2019, 2:02 pm

FermiGod wrote:
TheChiScientist wrote:
sciolyperson1 wrote:
Rule 4.II.j: "Teams who wish to file an appeal must leave their Boomilever with the event supervisor."

I'm sorry, but you really can't change much at this point.

Not really but we can have the Boomilever scores thrown out and at least they won't make the same mistake on some poor Div B. kid this weekend at their Div B. invitational... :(


in all honesty its pretty disappointing how you only care about your score and your placement based on a simple mistake the ES did. Just work on and improve your design for your next invite or competition. Don't stick your gut with something that happened 2 days ago.They put a lot of work into this invite and I wouldn't be that mad but just take it easy and chill.

I just want them to be more attentive as they have a reputation to preserve and I don't want them to be known for making simple mistakes. UChicago is a marvelous invitational with a good reputation but if they don't correct simple errors then they become major errors and then teams stop going. I never stated I cared about just my score... Do note I'm concerned for other teams suffering a similar error and it's in my interest that these type of mistakes be corrected for the good of everyone, not just me. I already know I did incredibly well but I also know that this a mistake that UChicago can correct for future invitationals but I suspect they aren't aware that they made said mistake so I'm just making sure they correct it in the future. :(
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby DarthBuilder » January 14th, 2019, 2:24 pm

TheChiScientist wrote:
FermiGod wrote:
TheChiScientist wrote:Not really but we can have the Boomilever scores thrown out and at least they won't make the same mistake on some poor Div B. kid this weekend at their Div B. invitational... :(


in all honesty its pretty disappointing how you only care about your score and your placement based on a simple mistake the ES did. Just work on and improve your design for your next invite or competition. Don't stick your gut with something that happened 2 days ago.They put a lot of work into this invite and I wouldn't be that mad but just take it easy and chill.

I just want them to be more attentive as they have a reputation to preserve and I don't want them to be known for making simple mistakes. UChicago is a marvelous invitational with a good reputation but if they don't correct simple errors then they become major errors and then teams stop going. I never stated I cared about just my score... Do note I'm concerned for other teams suffering a similar error and it's in my interest that these type of mistakes be corrected for the good of everyone, not just me. I already know I did incredibly well but I also know that this a mistake that UChicago can correct for future invitationals but I suspect they aren't aware that they made said mistake so I'm just making sure they correct it in the future. :(


Just email the directors then.
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby knightmoves » January 14th, 2019, 2:48 pm

FermiGod wrote:in all honesty its pretty disappointing how you only care about your score and your placement based on a simple mistake the ES did.


Actually, it's a combination of two mistakes.

Mistake 1: ES decided that TheChiScientist's boom was too long based on a misinterpretation of the rules.

Mistakes happen, ES aren't always as well prepared as we'd like, and don't always know the rules as well as some of the competitors. That's why the really bad mistake is mistake 2:

Mistake 2: ES didn't tell TheChiScientist that they were getting tiered, so there wasn't an opportunity for TheChiScientist to address this with the ES. To my mind, this is a much bigger mistake than the rules misunderstanding in mistake 1.

TheChiScientist's disappointing result required the ES to make both mistakes.

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby sciolyperson1 » January 14th, 2019, 2:52 pm

TheChiScientist wrote:
sciolyperson1 wrote:
waffletree wrote:oof rip


Rule 4.II.j: "Teams who wish to file an appeal must leave their Boomilever with the event supervisor."

I'm sorry, but you really can't change much at this point.

Not really but we can have the Boomilever scores thrown out and at least they won't make the same mistake on some poor Div B. kid this weekend at their Div B. invitational... :(


That doesn't happen 2 days after competition. Unless there was a really really huge mistake, like misgrading something totally wrong, they won't throw out all the boomi scores.
Think about it like this. All these teams build boomis for competition, yet because they misread one small rule (which doesn't affect many people), they throw the whole event out, including everyones hard work..
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby TheChiScientist » January 14th, 2019, 2:56 pm

knightmoves wrote:
FermiGod wrote:in all honesty its pretty disappointing how you only care about your score and your placement based on a simple mistake the ES did.


Actually, it's a combination of two mistakes.

Mistake 1: ES decided that TheChiScientist's boom was too long based on a misinterpretation of the rules.

Mistakes happen, ES aren't always as well prepared as we'd like, and don't always know the rules as well as some of the competitors. That's why the really bad mistake is mistake 2:

Mistake 2: ES didn't tell TheChiScientist that they were getting tiered, so there wasn't an opportunity for TheChiScientist to address this with the ES. To my mind, this is a much bigger mistake than the rules misunderstanding in mistake 1.

TheChiScientist's disappointing result required the ES to make both mistakes.

There we go! That's the biggest mistakes that were made! Anyways I'm not really too concerned as I will be making contact with UChicago so they can correct these mistakes in time for their Div B Invitational. :D
Last edited by TheChiScientist on January 14th, 2019, 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby knightmoves » January 14th, 2019, 2:59 pm

dholdgreve wrote:a number of kids at the Div B Centerville competition had the bolt out at 42.5 CM from the testing wall, having misread the rules. They must have thought that the inside edge of the block was to be 40 CM. This, of course is incorrect. It should be dimensioned from the wall to the CENTERLINE of the bolt to be at least 40 CM, and no more than 45 CM (although I have no idea why there is a maximum)


Practicality. If there's no maximum, someone will show up with a device that puts the chain/bucket in the middle of one of the legs of the table or something. With a defined maximum, you know what the table has to support.

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby TheChiScientist » January 14th, 2019, 3:01 pm

sciolyperson1 wrote:
TheChiScientist wrote:
sciolyperson1 wrote:
Rule 4.II.j: "Teams who wish to file an appeal must leave their Boomilever with the event supervisor."

I'm sorry, but you really can't change much at this point.

Not really but we can have the Boomilever scores thrown out and at least they won't make the same mistake on some poor Div B. kid this weekend at their Div B. invitational... :(


That doesn't happen 2 days after competition. Unless there was a really really huge mistake, like misgrading something totally wrong, they won't throw out all the boomi scores.
Think about it like this. All these teams build boomis for competition, yet because they misread one small rule (which doesn't affect many people), they throw the whole event out, including everyones hard work..

I decided to mention the throwing out of the results because a similar result occurred a few days after Palatine when the ES's had a similar error occur due to an oversight in Boomilever with one specific team. Evidence here. Note how scores were thrown out? Just saying that could occur.
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby sciencecat42 » January 14th, 2019, 7:17 pm

dholdgreve wrote:a number of kids at the Div B Centerville competition had the bolt out at 42.5 CM from the testing wall, having misread the rules. They must have thought that the inside edge of the block was to be 40 CM. This, of course is incorrect. It should be dimensioned from the wall to the CENTERLINE of the bolt to be at least 40 CM, and no more than 45 CM (although I have no idea why there is a maximum)

Also, FWIW, many, many Div B teams were way above the 20 CM drop line. Many as high or higher than Div C (at 15 CM). Still scratching my head on that one! Maybe thinking that by going shorter, they save weight? No clue!


To give them the benefit of the doubt, I'll often construct my boomilevers with a centimeter or so of tolerance just to be on the safe side.

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby Anonymous15 » January 14th, 2019, 8:02 pm

Hi everyone!

So I'm trying to build a testing setup for me to test boomilevers so that I can work out any building complications before invitationals. I am aware of the testing setup's general appearance, but I have nothing that I can use to build it right now. I also have no power tools or anything like that. Do any of you have any suggestions on things I can use/what I should buy to constuct a testing setup? Also, I don't really know how to build a testing setup, so if anyone could give any feedback, I would greatly appreciate it!

Additionally, I was going through my designs, and I was wondering how to get the tension members aligned with the compression members in such a way that both the tension and compression members will attach perfectly perpendicular to the wall. Are there any calculations to get this perfectly right, or is this something that requires estimation?

Lastly, is a jig necessary for this event? I know that you definitely need a jig for towers, but apart from the base and the distal end, the construction of the boomilever doesn't seem that complex. Would a jig be necessary to hold anything together?

Thank you all so much!
Last edited by Anonymous15 on January 14th, 2019, 8:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby MadCow2357 » January 14th, 2019, 8:05 pm

TheChiScientist wrote:
knightmoves wrote:
FermiGod wrote:in all honesty its pretty disappointing how you only care about your score and your placement based on a simple mistake the ES did.


Actually, it's a combination of two mistakes.

Mistake 1: ES decided that TheChiScientist's boom was too long based on a misinterpretation of the rules.

Mistakes happen, ES aren't always as well prepared as we'd like, and don't always know the rules as well as some of the competitors. That's why the really bad mistake is mistake 2:

Mistake 2: ES didn't tell TheChiScientist that they were getting tiered, so there wasn't an opportunity for TheChiScientist to address this with the ES. To my mind, this is a much bigger mistake than the rules misunderstanding in mistake 1.

TheChiScientist's disappointing result required the ES to make both mistakes.

There we go! That's the biggest mistakes that were made! Anyways I'm not really too concerned as I will be making contact with UChicago so they can correct these mistakes in time for their Div B Invitational. :D

To be honest, I think we can all stop with the opinions about Chi's appeal and stuff. I believe that he has handled it remarkably well, considering that he was pretty much in the unknown for the duration of the competition. Moral of the story: know that supervisors will make mistakes, so be eagle-eyed about their handling, scoring, etc. of your device
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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby Anonymous15 » January 15th, 2019, 6:23 pm

Just reposting so it doesn't get lost in the other forum posts:

Hi everyone!

So I'm trying to build a testing setup for me to test boomilevers so that I can work out any building complications before invitationals. I am aware of the testing setup's general appearance, but I have nothing that I can use to build it right now. I also have no power tools or anything like that. Do any of you have any suggestions on things I can use/what I should buy to constuct a testing setup? Also, I don't really know how to build a testing setup, so if anyone could give any feedback, I would greatly appreciate it!

Additionally, I was going through my designs, and I was wondering how to get the tension members aligned with the compression members in such a way that both the tension and compression members will attach perfectly perpendicular to the wall. Are there any calculations to get this perfectly right, or is this something that requires estimation?

Lastly, is a jig necessary for this event? I know that you definitely need a jig for towers, but apart from the base and the distal end, the construction of the boomilever doesn't seem that complex. Would a jig be necessary to hold anything together?

Thank you all so much!

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Re: Boomilever B/C

Postby MadCow2357 » January 15th, 2019, 7:00 pm

Anonymous15 wrote:Just reposting so it doesn't get lost in the other forum posts:

Hi everyone!

So I'm trying to build a testing setup for me to test boomilevers so that I can work out any building complications before invitationals. I am aware of the testing setup's general appearance, but I have nothing that I can use to build it right now. I also have no power tools or anything like that. Do any of you have any suggestions on things I can use/what I should buy to constuct a testing setup? Also, I don't really know how to build a testing setup, so if anyone could give any feedback, I would greatly appreciate it!

Additionally, I was going through my designs, and I was wondering how to get the tension members aligned with the compression members in such a way that both the tension and compression members will attach perfectly perpendicular to the wall. Are there any calculations to get this perfectly right, or is this something that requires estimation?

Lastly, is a jig necessary for this event? I know that you definitely need a jig for towers, but apart from the base and the distal end, the construction of the boomilever doesn't seem that complex. Would a jig be necessary to hold anything together?

Thank you all so much!

1. Buy some plywood, have Home Depot cut it for you. They can do that :) . You'll have to give them the lengths, of course. Use a hammer and nails to attach everything, not hard.

2. For both the tension and compression members to be perpendicular... ummm Not sure if I'm understanding your question correctly. Could you elaborate?

3. A jig is not required.
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