Interpretation of 3e

Araluen
Member
Member
Posts: 10
Joined: September 4th, 2018, 7:52 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Interpretation of 3e

Post by Araluen » September 4th, 2018, 8:00 am

"Before and throughout loading, no portion of the Boomilever may touch the testing wall
below the Contact Depth Line which is more than 20 cm (Div. B) or 15 cm (Div. C) below the
center of the hole for the Mounting Hook (5.a.iii.)."

Is this rule stating that the Contact Depth Line is at a distance greater than 15cm or exactly at 15cm from the Mounting Hook? Sorry if this question is stupid.

User avatar
Unome
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4250
Joined: January 26th, 2014, 12:48 pm
Division: Grad
State: GA
Location: somewhere in the sciolyverse
Has thanked: 60 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Unome » September 4th, 2018, 8:24 am

Araluen wrote:"Before and throughout loading, no portion of the Boomilever may touch the testing wall
below the Contact Depth Line which is more than 20 cm (Div. B) or 15 cm (Div. C) below the
center of the hole for the Mounting Hook (5.a.iii.)."

Is this rule stating that the Contact Depth Line is at a distance greater than 15cm or exactly at 15cm from the Mounting Hook? Sorry if this question is stupid.
The hook is at some vertical position on the wall. The boomilever can only contact the wall above the line. The line is 20 cm below the hook for Div B, and 15 cm below the hook for Div C. I see what you mean about the confusing wording though.
Userpage
Chattahoochee High School Class of 2018
Georgia Tech Class of 2022

Opinions expressed on this site are not official; the only place for official rules changes and FAQs is soinc.org.

User avatar
Things2do
Member
Member
Posts: 153
Joined: February 12th, 2018, 2:30 pm
Division: C
State: TN
Location: Unfortunately, not the Desert Southwest
Has thanked: 9 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Things2do » September 4th, 2018, 8:28 am

Araluen wrote:"Before and throughout loading, no portion of the Boomilever may touch the testing wall
below the Contact Depth Line which is more than 20 cm (Div. B) or 15 cm (Div. C) below the
center of the hole for the Mounting Hook (5.a.iii.)."

Is this rule stating that the Contact Depth Line is at a distance greater than 15cm or exactly at 15cm from the Mounting Hook? Sorry if this question is stupid.
I read that as the line is at least 20/15 cm below the center of the hook's hole because of the "more than". This might be a good one for the clarifications when they open on October 1st.

"There are no stupid questions, there are only stupid mistakes."
John 5:46-47
Eagle Scout
Builder Cult
 Backyard Botany, Can Racer, Name That Scientist,
CTW, Meteo., WV, Scrambler, Road S., Dy. Plan., Fast Facts, Rocks/Mine., Optics, MTV, Remote Sensing, ExpeD., Geo. Map., Fossils, Circuits., Thermo., Boomi., WS, Machines, GV
More here.Image

Araluen
Member
Member
Posts: 10
Joined: September 4th, 2018, 7:52 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Araluen » September 4th, 2018, 9:13 pm

Unome wrote:
Araluen wrote:"Before and throughout loading, no portion of the Boomilever may touch the testing wall
below the Contact Depth Line which is more than 20 cm (Div. B) or 15 cm (Div. C) below the
center of the hole for the Mounting Hook (5.a.iii.)."

Is this rule stating that the Contact Depth Line is at a distance greater than 15cm or exactly at 15cm from the Mounting Hook? Sorry if this question is stupid.
The hook is at some vertical position on the wall. The boomilever can only contact the wall above the line. The line is 20 cm below the hook for Div B, and 15 cm below the hook for Div C. I see what you mean about the confusing wording though.
Ohhh, Thank you! That makes alot more sense now.

Araluen
Member
Member
Posts: 10
Joined: September 4th, 2018, 7:52 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Araluen » September 4th, 2018, 9:13 pm

Things2do wrote:
Araluen wrote:"Before and throughout loading, no portion of the Boomilever may touch the testing wall
below the Contact Depth Line which is more than 20 cm (Div. B) or 15 cm (Div. C) below the
center of the hole for the Mounting Hook (5.a.iii.)."

Is this rule stating that the Contact Depth Line is at a distance greater than 15cm or exactly at 15cm from the Mounting Hook? Sorry if this question is stupid.
I read that as the line is at least 20/15 cm below the center of the hook's hole because of the "more than". This might be a good one for the clarifications when they open on October 1st.

"There are no stupid questions, there are only stupid mistakes."
I'm not sure how the clarifications work but if you'd go ahead and let them know i'd appreciate it. Thanks!

Araluen
Member
Member
Posts: 10
Joined: September 4th, 2018, 7:52 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Araluen » September 4th, 2018, 9:49 pm

I'm not sure if i should post again on the same "page" so...


The Boomilever must support the Loading Assembly (5.b.) at the loading point which must be between 40 cm and 45 cm from the testing wall (4.Part II.e.ii.).

Does this rule state that the entire loading block must be located between 40 to 45 cm or that the chain has to be between those measurements? If it's the second option could the chain be at 41 cm and the loading block be 38.5-43.5(5cm width)

User avatar
Unome
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4250
Joined: January 26th, 2014, 12:48 pm
Division: Grad
State: GA
Location: somewhere in the sciolyverse
Has thanked: 60 times
Been thanked: 29 times

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Unome » September 5th, 2018, 4:15 am

Araluen wrote:I'm not sure if i should post again on the same "page" so...


The Boomilever must support the Loading Assembly (5.b.) at the loading point which must be between 40 cm and 45 cm from the testing wall (4.Part II.e.ii.).

Does this rule state that the entire loading block must be located between 40 to 45 cm or that the chain has to be between those measurements? If it's the second option could the chain be at 41 cm and the loading block be 38.5-43.5(5cm width)
Per rule 4.II.e.ii the loading point is defined as the centerline of the chain, so your scenario would be acceptable.
Userpage
Chattahoochee High School Class of 2018
Georgia Tech Class of 2022

Opinions expressed on this site are not official; the only place for official rules changes and FAQs is soinc.org.

Araluen
Member
Member
Posts: 10
Joined: September 4th, 2018, 7:52 am
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by Araluen » September 5th, 2018, 7:34 am

Unome wrote:
Araluen wrote:I'm not sure if i should post again on the same "page" so...


The Boomilever must support the Loading Assembly (5.b.) at the loading point which must be between 40 cm and 45 cm from the testing wall (4.Part II.e.ii.).

Does this rule state that the entire loading block must be located between 40 to 45 cm or that the chain has to be between those measurements? If it's the second option could the chain be at 41 cm and the loading block be 38.5-43.5(5cm width)
Per rule 4.II.e.ii the loading point is defined as the centerline of the chain, so your scenario would be acceptable.
Thank you!

User avatar
mnoga
Member
Member
Posts: 109
Joined: March 19th, 2015, 6:12 pm
Division: C
State: CA
Location: Los Altos, CA
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by mnoga » September 5th, 2018, 2:42 pm

Araluen wrote:
Things2do wrote:
Araluen wrote:"Before and throughout loading, no portion of the Boomilever may touch the testing wall
below the Contact Depth Line which is more than 20 cm (Div. B) or 15 cm (Div. C) below the
center of the hole for the Mounting Hook (5.a.iii.)."

Is this rule stating that the Contact Depth Line is at a distance greater than 15cm or exactly at 15cm from the Mounting Hook? Sorry if this question is stupid.
I read that as the line is at least 20/15 cm below the center of the hook's hole because of the "more than". This might be a good one for the clarifications when they open on October 1st.

"There are no stupid questions, there are only stupid mistakes."
I'm not sure how the clarifications work but if you'd go ahead and let them know i'd appreciate it. Thanks!
My interpretation is that the 15 cm line is exactly 15 cm below the center of the hole where the J-hook is installed into the test wall (device). I assume that test wall device would probably attach to one of those sand tables used for towers and bridge devices. And, on the test wall there would be two lines drawn, one at exactly 15 cm below the J-hook center point hole, and the other 20 cm below (for Division B).

dholdgreve
Coach
Coach
Posts: 560
Joined: February 6th, 2006, 2:20 pm
Division: B
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: Interpretation of 3e

Post by dholdgreve » September 6th, 2018, 8:45 am

I'm also confused by the wording... This opens the possibility of providing an unfair advantage to teams that may know that the line is something in excess of 15 or 20 cm below the hook.... As an example, a team is asked to run booms at an invitational. They could potentially bring a B testing wall to a C competition and be fully compliant with the rules, since the rules state that it must be at least 15 cm from the hook. If their team know this, they show up with a 19.9 cm high boom and clearly have an advantage since the angle is greater on their boom... Definitely need clarified.

Totally agree with the thoughts on the tiering of booms holding less than 3,000 grams. With no bonus, there is no reason to go ultra light, with or without this rule!

Another clarification that needs made is where is the hook distance from wall measured. Yes, it says 2.5 cm, but is that from the actual distal end of the metal, or is it from the inside face of the apex of the hook? If it is inside face of hook apex, it will be difficult (i.e. impossible) to hook a boom to it without first removing the hook. I believe the intent is from the actual hook end of metal, but there will be someone, somewhere that will not interpret it that way. This will drastically effect the design and angle of the booms.

Final rant: Several years ago, we attended an invitational where they used a Black and Decker workmate to clamp the vertical mounting surface to. As luck would have it, we ended up in the first first testing period. There were a couple booms that went in front of us, that failed relatively early in the testing. When we went, we went deep into the loading process. When they hit about 11 or 12 kg, the entire workmate started to tip over from the eccentric load being applied. The E/C panicked, put his foot on the bottom bar of the workmate and slammed it back to the ground... As you can imagine, this telegraphed through the board,and into the boom... It snapped back to its original position, causing the bucket to come back off the floor and actually bounce! How it didn't bust that boom I will never understand! After that, they placed several sand bags over the back bar of the workmate to hold it down... Just a word of caution in case you happen to run into this scenario this year!
Dan Holdgreve
Northmont Science Olympiad

Dedicated to the Memory of Len Joeris
"For the betterment of Science"

Locked

Return to “Boomilever B/C”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest