End Task

C8H10N4O2!
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Re: End Task

Postby C8H10N4O2! » November 15th, 2018, 8:48 pm

Does the actual part of the device that lifts the platform have to be free-standing, or can it be guided?
I'm doing a scissor lift, and its not going as straight up as I would like. Can I have a small wall put in to help guide the lift part up if it never touches the platform or the battery?

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Re: End Task

Postby TheSquaad » November 16th, 2018, 4:33 am

C8H10N4O2! wrote:Does the actual part of the device that lifts the platform have to be free-standing, or can it be guided?
I'm doing a scissor lift, and its not going as straight up as I would like. Can I have a small wall put in to help guide the lift part up if it never touches the platform or the battery?


From what I read, your lifting mechanism does not have to be freestanding. We’re planning on using rails to guide the superstructure under the platform.

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Re: End Task

Postby PM2017 » November 25th, 2018, 5:53 pm

I'd like your guys' opinions on this:

Does standard include rechargeable 9v batteries? My rechargeable 9V battery seems to be lighter than my nondischargeable 9v batteries.
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Re: End Task

Postby CookiePie1 » November 25th, 2018, 7:14 pm

PM2017 wrote:I'd like your guys' opinions on this:

Does standard include rechargeable 9v batteries? My rechargeable 9V battery seems to be lighter than my nondischargeable 9v batteries.


Personally, I'd say they are standard, but maybe you should submit an FAQ.
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Re: End Task

Postby TheSquaad » November 26th, 2018, 6:28 am

PM2017 wrote:I'd like your guys' opinions on this:

Does standard include rechargeable 9v batteries? My rechargeable 9V battery seems to be lighter than my nondischargeable 9v batteries.


I'd go with the heavier batteries either way. They're less likely to fall.

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Re: End Task

Postby annabelle0308 » November 29th, 2018, 4:57 pm

The Construction Parameters section letter c states that "Any action in the device not designed to contribute to the completion of the Final Action will not count for points...." Does this mean that you MUST include the Final Action in your device? Or could you possibly make a machine using only the starting action and Scorable Actions?

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Re: End Task

Postby PM2017 » November 29th, 2018, 5:40 pm

annabelle0308 wrote:The Construction Parameters section letter c states that "Any action in the device not designed to contribute to the completion of the Final Action will not count for points...." Does this mean that you MUST include the Final Action in your device? Or could you possibly make a machine using only the starting action and Scorable Actions?

I believe you get tiered if you don't successfully accomplish the final action. Essentially, if you have a start task, all 12 actions, accurate chemical clock and 30x30x30 box, but no final action, you still lose to a team that only has a start task and successful final task.
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Re: End Task

Postby bearasauras » December 13th, 2018, 12:44 am

PM2017 wrote:
annabelle0308 wrote:The Construction Parameters section letter c states that "Any action in the device not designed to contribute to the completion of the Final Action will not count for points...." Does this mean that you MUST include the Final Action in your device? Or could you possibly make a machine using only the starting action and Scorable Actions?

I believe you get tiered if you don't successfully accomplish the final action. Essentially, if you have a start task, all 12 actions, accurate chemical clock and 30x30x30 box, but no final action, you still lose to a team that only has a start task and successful final task.


I'm trying to find that, do you know which rule states that it would be placed in a lower tier?

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Re: End Task

Postby ScottMaurer19 » December 13th, 2018, 4:36 am

bearasauras wrote:
PM2017 wrote:
annabelle0308 wrote:The Construction Parameters section letter c states that "Any action in the device not designed to contribute to the completion of the Final Action will not count for points...." Does this mean that you MUST include the Final Action in your device? Or could you possibly make a machine using only the starting action and Scorable Actions?

I believe you get tiered if you don't successfully accomplish the final action. Essentially, if you have a start task, all 12 actions, accurate chemical clock and 30x30x30 box, but no final action, you still lose to a team that only has a start task and successful final task.


I'm trying to find that, do you know which rule states that it would be placed in a lower tier?

Last year it did, but this year the rules do not state that tiering is a consequence of not following construction parameters as far as I can tell. Instead I think you would just get 0 points for all of your actions
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Re: End Task

Postby windu34 » December 13th, 2018, 7:38 am

ScottMaurer19 wrote:
bearasauras wrote:
PM2017 wrote:I believe you get tiered if you don't successfully accomplish the final action. Essentially, if you have a start task, all 12 actions, accurate chemical clock and 30x30x30 box, but no final action, you still lose to a team that only has a start task and successful final task.


I'm trying to find that, do you know which rule states that it would be placed in a lower tier?


Last year it did, but this year the rules do not state that tiering is a consequence of not following construction parameters as far as I can tell. Instead I think you would just get 0 points for all of your actions

This is by no means official nor does it represent the opinion of any of the organizations that I represent. That said:
I am not so sure these interpretations are correct. 3.c. is stating that "Any action in the device not designed to contribute to the completion of the Final Action will not count for points". I would argue that as long as the team intends to complete the Final Action as shown by the ASL, then they would earn points for all the tasks even if the final task didn't work for some reason. However, if they didnt even "attempt" the final task in their device, then I can see how the argument could be made to not award any points for any of the preceding tasks.
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Re: End Task

Postby ScottMaurer19 » December 13th, 2018, 10:21 am

windu34 wrote:
ScottMaurer19 wrote:
bearasauras wrote:
I'm trying to find that, do you know which rule states that it would be placed in a lower tier?


Last year it did, but this year the rules do not state that tiering is a consequence of not following construction parameters as far as I can tell. Instead I think you would just get 0 points for all of your actions

This is by no means official nor does it represent the opinion of any of the organizations that I represent. That said:
I am not so sure these interpretations are correct. 3.c. is stating that "Any action in the device not designed to contribute to the completion of the Final Action will not count for points". I would argue that as long as the team intends to complete the Final Action as shown by the ASL, then they would earn points for all the tasks even if the final task didn't work for some reason. However, if they didnt even "attempt" the final task in their device, then I can see how the argument could be made to not award any points for any of the preceding tasks.

That's what I was trying to say. If there is no action that attempts the final action then all other actions receive zero points. If a team attempts but fails then they would.
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Re: End Task

Postby antigem » December 27th, 2018, 10:09 pm

Is there anything in a snap circuits kit that would help? I was looking at a kit with a motor, but it was to power a fan and I don't think that it would have enough power to lift a scissor lift
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Re: End Task

Postby CookiePie1 » December 29th, 2018, 2:12 pm

antigem wrote:Is there anything in a snap circuits kit that would help? I was looking at a kit with a motor, but it was to power a fan and I don't think that it would have enough power to lift a scissor lift


it could definitely power it if the scissor lift was light and relatively smooth on the joints.
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Re: End Task

Postby MgEHS22 » January 11th, 2019, 6:50 pm

When it says before it becomes the highest point of the device, does that include a pulley that pulls the platform up?

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Re: End Task

Postby PM2017 » January 11th, 2019, 9:11 pm

MgEHS22 wrote:When it says before it becomes the highest point of the device, does that include a pulley that pulls the platform up?

Yes, it does. An easy solution is to have a superstructure under the platform, that has a point at which the string attaches. this point could be below the the pulley, while the attached platform itself is above.
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