Sounds of Music C

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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby Creationist127 » January 17th, 2019, 8:24 am

So I noticed the rules mentioned how event supervisors “may” move the testing equipment closer for the pitch part. (Part II.f.iii)

Thing is, I’m afraid an event supervisor will decide this means they can choose to not move it closer, and on our instrument (copper pipe xylophone), if we want to play in tune, only 3-4 of the pitches register at 1 m. We tried using a cardboard box placed behind the instrument as a resonator but it doesn’t really seem to make a difference.

Do you guys have any recommendations for us? We are currently using a mallet made of rubber bands wrapped around a dowel. (This is necessary because the wooden dowel alone, while louder, causes the pitch to head towards the higher overtones)
Unless the ES is unnecessarily cruel, they will probably move the test equipment over.
Scratch that. Unless they are incompetent inexperienced, they will move the test equipment over. If they don't, and you get a bad score, that is probably grounds for an appeal.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby Justin72835 » January 17th, 2019, 8:42 am

So I noticed the rules mentioned how event supervisors “may” move the testing equipment closer for the pitch part. (Part II.f.iii)

Thing is, I’m afraid an event supervisor will decide this means they can choose to not move it closer, and on our instrument (copper pipe xylophone), if we want to play in tune, only 3-4 of the pitches register at 1 m. We tried using a cardboard box placed behind the instrument as a resonator but it doesn’t really seem to make a difference.

Do you guys have any recommendations for us? We are currently using a mallet made of rubber bands wrapped around a dowel. (This is necessary because the wooden dowel alone, while louder, causes the pitch to head towards the higher overtones)
Unless the ES is unnecessarily cruel, they will probably move the test equipment over.
Scratch that. Unless they are incompetent inexperienced, they will move the test equipment over. If they don't, and you get a bad score, that is probably grounds for an appeal.
This is true. Good proctors will almost always listen to you provided that what is being asked is within the rules. On that same note, always bring a copy of the rules to events like these. If you ask and your proctor says no, you can sometimes change their mind by showing them specific statements on there.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby TheSquaad » January 17th, 2019, 2:29 pm

Does anybody know what scores would have been needed to place at MIT?
Both Acton teams (who scored 1st and 2nd) had perfect builds (full pitch score, >85 decibels, full log)

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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby markuswso17 » January 18th, 2019, 10:46 am

What apps or programs are you using to measure the average pitch? Soinc recommends to use the Science Journal app by Google, but it include 0Hz as part of the average in data collection, causing the average to be lower than the actual note average. I know that you can repeat the note as many times as possible in those 5 seconds, but this is not an optimal situation because each start of a note will naturally be higher pitched than the sustain of the note. What have you found to work?
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby Riptide » January 18th, 2019, 10:58 am

What apps or programs are you using to measure the average pitch? Soinc recommends to use the Science Journal app by Google, but it include 0Hz as part of the average in data collection, causing the average to be lower than the actual note average. I know that you can repeat the note as many times as possible in those 5 seconds, but this is not an optimal situation because each start of a note will naturally be higher pitched than the sustain of the note. What have you found to work?
In science journal you can crop the recording to take the average over only a certain portion of the entire recording (click on the recording; the 3 dot menu on the top right gives a crop option). Realistically you only need a second or two to get an accurate average, so you can crop it to a portion with no 0’s/overtones showing up. I don’t think there’s any specific app or device that would differ from Science Journal picking up 0’s.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby markuswso17 » January 18th, 2019, 11:04 am

The rules state that: "The pitch measurement will be the average value during the 5 seconds.". To me that means that the average will be taken from the entirety of the 5 seconds, and not what looks like the average fundamental.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby Riptide » January 18th, 2019, 11:22 am

The rules state that: "The pitch measurement will be the average value during the 5 seconds.". To me that means that the average will be taken from the entirety of the 5 seconds, and not what looks like the average fundamental.
My bad I thought you were asking from a competitors point of view. If you’re just trying to calibrate your own build then doing the crop thing works. From a proctors point of view I don’t think there’s anything they can really do short of taking the average over a time less than 5 seconds, which is clearly against the rules. No app will just magically not record 0 or strange overtones - it’ll be up to students to build a device that does its best to avoid this by sustaining the note for the entire 5 seconds without having to repeat it while keeping it at a volume that the app will register it at consistently.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby markuswso17 » January 18th, 2019, 11:26 am

The rules state that: "The pitch measurement will be the average value during the 5 seconds.". To me that means that the average will be taken from the entirety of the 5 seconds, and not what looks like the average fundamental.
My bad I thought you were asking from a competitors point of view. If you’re just trying to calibrate your own build then doing the crop thing works. From a proctors point of view I don’t think there’s anything they can really do short of taking the average over a time less than 5 seconds, which is clearly against the rules. No app will just magically not record 0 or strange overtones - it’ll be up to students to build a device that does its best to avoid this by sustaining the note for the entire 5 seconds without having to repeat it while keeping it at a volume that the app will register it at consistently.
It's more of a dear of inconsistency between different tournaments. Do you change the instrument to not have 0Hz as part of the average or do you find a fix to the problem and have all tournaments be the same. To me, having 0Hz as part of the average doesn't seem fair because it also depends on how well an Es's microphone pics up the frequency. There are just a lot of factors that should be figured out and be mentioned officially from Science Olympiad.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby Birdmusic » January 18th, 2019, 8:58 pm

Unless the ES is unnecessarily cruel, they will probably move the test equipment over.
Scratch that. Unless they are incompetent inexperienced, they will move the test equipment over. If they don't, and you get a bad score, that is probably grounds for an appeal.
This is true. Good proctors will almost always listen to you provided that what is being asked is within the rules. On that same note, always bring a copy of the rules to events like these. If you ask and your proctor says no, you can sometimes change their mind by showing them specific statements on there.
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Re: Sounds of Music C

Postby SciolyHarsh » January 20th, 2019, 7:34 pm

This happened to us at a recent invitational. We made a xylophone and right before the tournament, we realized that it wouldn't work for the invitational, so we used our backup instrument. But it ended up pointless, because the supervisors ended up measuring the note rather than the frequency in Science Journal. They just called out whether it was sharp or flat....
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