Junkyard Challenge B

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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby bob3443 » October 13th, 2009, 10:38 am

so the golf ball isnt part of the device?
and dropping it down a ramp or something is not a direct touch?
it is a direct touch, but you have to drop it in order to start the device
for the first question, it has to be part of the device, because that's how the device starts.
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby wlsguy » October 13th, 2009, 11:44 am

so the golf ball isnt part of the device?
and dropping it down a ramp or something is not a direct touch?
it is a direct touch, but you have to drop it in order to start the device
for the first question, it has to be part of the device, because that's how the device starts.
I disagree. The rules state the "teams will drop a standard unmodifed golf ball into the device at its central point."
Since the golf ball is being dropped into the device it cannot be both part of and independant from the device itself.

In any case, the rules appear to intend the ball be a seperate item and not part of the device. No penalty to do the inital drop.
Problems could arise if the ball does not drop correctly and the device does not start. (i.e. can the golf ball be touched without penalty?)

Also, some could say that unless you physically have a team member hold the ball and let it go, they did not start the device with the required start task and do not get the 58 points associated with it.

Maybe it's time to submit a clarification.
1) can the golf ball be touched without penalty after it is dropped into the device?

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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby brobo » October 13th, 2009, 11:48 am

I think a better question is
"Is the golf ball part of the device?"

If you COULD touch the golf ball, then what stops someone from picking up the ball and droping it onto one of the mouse traps? That destroys the whole purpose of the event. I think that once the ball is droped, you may not touch ANYTHING untill the device stops operating, or untill all 4 moustraps have been trigered.
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby fmtiger124 » October 13th, 2009, 11:58 am

I think you're reading way into the rule basically the only time you can touch is when you drop the golf ball onto the deviece if you have to trigger the device through touch anytime thereafter you recieve a peanalty.
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby doctor » October 13th, 2009, 2:25 pm

also once u drop the ball, the ball cannot be the one to set off hte trap, it must be like a pulley system or a level or what ever that sets off the traps
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby gyourkoshaven » October 13th, 2009, 2:58 pm

also once u drop the ball, the ball cannot be the one to set off hte trap, it must be like a pulley system or a level or what ever that sets off the traps
Why can't it....?

My interpretation of the rule is after the ball is dropped, you can't touch ANYTHING without receiving a penalty.
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby doctor » October 13th, 2009, 3:26 pm

yes u cant physically touch anything else except the ball once
but the ball cant physically set of the trap either
this event is sort of like mission possible
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby wlsguy » October 13th, 2009, 8:16 pm

yes u cant physically touch anything else except the ball once
but the ball cant physically set of the trap either
this event is sort of like mission possible
I agree with both of your statements
1) you can't touch anthing except the ball (and you can only drop it once to start the device)
2) The ball cannot directly set off a trap.(because you just touched it and therefore is considered a direct touch)

I think this makes the true intent of the rules clear. I also think anything outside of this would be "taking a chance".

The only thing still unclear is if the ball must be physcially dropped by the team from outside the device?
This ruling could prohibit having the ball in a tube and pulling out a stopper or pin to make it drop. This method makes the golf ball part of the device.
I think it was clarified when they said "teams would drop the ball INTO the device" but this is not exactly clear.

Anyway, we will plan to drop it from outside just to be sure

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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby Dark Sabre » October 13th, 2009, 8:52 pm

Okay, this starts from way back in the thread, but this seemed to be where this all got started...I know some of these have already been answered correctly, but :shrug:

Here's how I would judge a device, assuming that the ball rolls down the ramp straight to a mousetrap:
Is rolling a marble down a ramp different from dropping it? No, you are touching the ball. Blowing on it is a "touch" too for that matter
Is opening a gate not a touch? If you are touching something and it isn't you dropping the pingpong ball, it is a touch and you are penalized appropriately. The rules were distinguishing between a "direct" touch and a normal touch with that example
Is dropping the pingpong ball into the center of the device, from which point it immediately rolls to trigger a mousetrap, a direct touch? I would submit a clarification on this one. I think so, but it should be cleared up.
Can you touch the pingpong ball again after the device starts without penalty? No. Except for the initial drop, any other touches are definitely touches. Timing and scoring begin when the event sup counts down to Go, not when the device starts operating correctly. Even if you mistakenly drop the pingpong ball and miss the cup or whatever, touching it again is a touch. I'm heartless, don't miss.
Can you drop the pingpong ball from inside the device? Why would you want to? I think the center is going to be the highest point on everyone's device. Design so it is a non-issue. I think you shouldn't drop from inside.

That's how I would judge those, given no further NSO clarifications. Probability is really high that I won't be your judge though.
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Re: Junkyard Challenge B

Postby brobo » October 14th, 2009, 4:52 am

How are the mousetraps moving going to be scored?
It says in the rules that there's a 2pt. penalty for every 1cm that the mousetrap is off....
Is that BEFORE the contraption starts, or after ie. if the mousetraps bounces when it's set off?
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