Thoughts? (on rule points)

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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Primate » October 26th, 2009, 3:30 pm

Yeah, I was thinking of having the power produced from the solar panel be used for an unlisted mechanical action. I know it's kind of risky to introduce another mechanical aspect, but I figured at least I won't have to worry about that rule clarification. (Can you even get a motor to run off of .5 volts? The random motors I have lying around hardly spin at 1 volt...)

The wind power also seems ridiculously unreliable to me. I'll probably end up sticking the propeller in an airtight box with a windmill to trip the next action. I can't think of anything easier--all wind does is move stuff, and blowing a car around or something seems likely to fail.
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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Flavorflav » October 28th, 2009, 7:10 am

sean9keenan wrote:Bonjour,

I figured that I'd post some of the rule clarifications that we're sending in... and would like to hear what you think of them. While I realize that some of them are a stretch, I'd rather hear an answer then have to wander into planning without clarifications. I know that you guys can't make anything official, and we are sending them in, I was just wondering what your thoughts on these were. Note that I know that a lot of this isn't properly formatted for a clarification... and on a whole I think that some are definitely more critical then other clarifications, I also added comments below some of them.

1) As specified in the rules, points are granted for only whole seconds, is this true for point deductions, is it only a point off for a full second over(ie at regionals is 60.0 the same as 60.9)? Also for the second tie breaker, is this time measured only to full seconds? To then be broken by the third tie breaker? Or is it otherwise measured to the most accurate time measurement available?

2) Are Laser pointers that follow the specifications pointed out on the soinc.org website allowed on the device? More specifically are they one of the allowed electronics, and are they allowed to be powered?
Laser pointers and Lightbulbs are disallowed in section 3d, but lightbulbs are almost allowed in section 3g (see below clarification). They could be banned under the hazardous materials clause in 3e, but the soinc site says that they aren't hazardous if they are class II. Mainly, I like lasers... :D

3) Are lightbulbs allowed?
They aren't under the allowed list of electronics, unless you consider a light bulb a "resistor" but then why wouldn't a wire be a "resistor". It does later in the rules give flashlights a specific allowance of sorts (3g)... but flashlights are a combination of specialized resistors and gas, which could be considered a dangerous material.

4) Is the photocell specified in section 4b required to be the sole use of power for the motor? or can it otherwise act as a trigger?
I'm expecting that people will say that it has to be entirely powered, but it's worth a shot...

5) Are Light Dependent Resistors allowed to be used on the device, or are photocells limited to devices that produce a voltage?
I like LDR's (and they are cheap) but alas are not on the list of specified electronics, they would also be easier/cheaper to use then photocells for many of the same tasks

6)What are the specifications on "switches" are only certain types allowed, such as SPST, or limit switches?
The reason for this question is that technically some digital electronics might be considered switches (such as a schmitt trigger) but are clearly digital, while other mechanical implementations of a simple switch might not be allowed, because they are not "just switches" whatever that might mean. Personally I'm least worried about this one, but better to air on the side of being too safe then getting DQ'ed

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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by StampingKid » October 28th, 2009, 11:18 am

Pardon me if this is obtuse but is a solar panel a photocell? I see photocell in the tasks for mp but I donot see solar panel.
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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by andrewwski » October 28th, 2009, 11:46 am

Correct, a more proper term for a "solar panel" is a photovoltaic cell.

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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by sean9keenan » October 29th, 2009, 4:59 pm

Still no response (unless my coach is with-holding information from me :? )

I don't know if this would be under FAQ's or Rule Clarifications though.... I suppose only time will tell.

I assume people are just going to be using lightbulbs then? I'm going to avoid LDR's for a bit, but I have some Light switch circuits from JYC that I would like to reuse... not to mention solar panels are a pain to use >.> I should get on that.

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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Paradox21 » October 30th, 2009, 9:05 am

Are you allowed to have one task complete 2 or more of the tasks listed to get points? For example, could you combine task c, turn a shaft for 40 seconds, with task g, raise a golfball at least 30cm, into one task that raises a golfball at least 30cm in 40 seconds and still get the points for both?
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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Flavorflav » October 31st, 2009, 5:07 am

andrewwski wrote:Correct, a more proper term for a "solar panel" is a photovoltaic cell.
Actually, I'm pretty sure this is not correct. I believe the relationship between a solar panel and a solar cell is the same as that between a battery and the wet or dry cells - i.e., the panel has a number of cells in it. Most solar cells seem to produce about 0.5 V, which may be inadequate for your purpose. Cheap solar panels are available which produce 4.5 or 6 V, which is probably more like what you want.

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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Flavorflav » October 31st, 2009, 5:15 am

Paradox21 wrote:Are you allowed to have one task complete 2 or more of the tasks listed to get points? For example, could you combine task c, turn a shaft for 40 seconds, with task g, raise a golfball at least 30cm, into one task that raises a golfball at least 30cm in 40 seconds and still get the points for both?
If it were up to me, the answer would be yes - but it isn't up to me. If you want to do that, I would put in a request for clarification.

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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Paradox21 » November 3rd, 2009, 6:40 pm

Paradox21 wrote:Are you allowed to have one task complete 2 or more of the tasks listed to get points? For example, could you combine task c, turn a shaft for 40 seconds, with task g, raise a golfball at least 30cm, into one task that raises a golfball at least 30cm in 40 seconds and still get the points for both?
Interesting, the reply to this was that it is not allowed because parallel tasks are not allowed.
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Re: Thoughts? (on rule points)

Post by Dark Sabre » November 3rd, 2009, 7:30 pm

You actually got a reply to an FAQ/Clarification you submitted?

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