Herpetology B/C

fabishkf
Member
Member
Posts: 13
Joined: February 17th, 2018, 10:41 am
Division: C
State: WI

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by fabishkf » January 13th, 2019, 10:49 am

same clade as crocodiles
Madison West '21 Hamilton '17
Geologic Mapping, Fossils, Designer Genes, Water Quality

UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F
Exalted Member
Exalted Member
Posts: 1518
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 7:42 am
Division: C
State: PA

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F » January 13th, 2019, 1:11 pm

fabishkf wrote:same clade as crocodiles
Reptiles don't include birds though: rather, a reptile is an amniote that is neither a mammal or a bird. This is because reptiles aren't actually a single clade.

fabishkf
Member
Member
Posts: 13
Joined: February 17th, 2018, 10:41 am
Division: C
State: WI

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by fabishkf » January 13th, 2019, 2:09 pm

Actually, birds are just not traditionally studied with reptiles because superficially they seem different. Phylogenetically, they are part of the clade Reptilia, which isn't a clade if you don't include birds. So even though they aren't studied together traditionally they are in the same monophyletic group (your definition of reptiles is correct in how they're usually studied however).
Madison West '21 Hamilton '17
Geologic Mapping, Fossils, Designer Genes, Water Quality

UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F
Exalted Member
Exalted Member
Posts: 1518
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 7:42 am
Division: C
State: PA

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F » January 13th, 2019, 4:32 pm

fabishkf wrote:Actually, birds are just not traditionally studied with reptiles because superficially they seem different. Phylogenetically, they are part of the clade Reptilia, which isn't a clade if you don't include birds. So even though they aren't studied together traditionally they are in the same monophyletic group (your definition of reptiles is correct in how they're usually studied however).
It is true that birds are part of the same clade as reptiles, but Reptilia is not a clade: it is a class. The clade that includes reptiles and birds is generally (read: as far as I know) called Sauropsida. Either way, it doesn't make sense for a bird to be on the Herpetology List because hereptologists don't study birds.

User avatar
kate!
Member
Member
Posts: 439
Joined: October 11th, 2017, 12:07 pm
Division: C
State: NY
Location: Ward Melville HS

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by kate! » January 13th, 2019, 4:40 pm

UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F wrote:
fabishkf wrote:Actually, birds are just not traditionally studied with reptiles because superficially they seem different. Phylogenetically, they are part of the clade Reptilia, which isn't a clade if you don't include birds. So even though they aren't studied together traditionally they are in the same monophyletic group (your definition of reptiles is correct in how they're usually studied however).
It is true that birds are part of the same clade as reptiles, but Reptilia is not a clade: it is a class. The clade that includes reptiles and birds is generally (read: as far as I know) called Sauropsida. Either way, it doesn't make sense for a bird to be on the Herpetology List because herpetologists don't study birds.
Also, Ornithology is literally an event so why would there be birds in any other event.
Two years ago I knew stuff about rocks, minerals, experiments, and ecosystems, yay!
Last year I knew stuff about amphibians, reptiles, freshwater, and more experiments, yay again!
Now I know stuff about oceanography, saltwater, birds, and fossils, yay for the third time!

UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F
Exalted Member
Exalted Member
Posts: 1518
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 7:42 am
Division: C
State: PA

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F » January 13th, 2019, 4:41 pm

kate! wrote:
UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F wrote:
fabishkf wrote:Actually, birds are just not traditionally studied with reptiles because superficially they seem different. Phylogenetically, they are part of the clade Reptilia, which isn't a clade if you don't include birds. So even though they aren't studied together traditionally they are in the same monophyletic group (your definition of reptiles is correct in how they're usually studied however).
It is true that birds are part of the same clade as reptiles, but Reptilia is not a clade: it is a class. The clade that includes reptiles and birds is generally (read: as far as I know) called Sauropsida. Either way, it doesn't make sense for a bird to be on the Herpetology List because herpetologists don't study birds.
Also, Ornithology is literally an event so why would there be birds in any other event.
Yeah, I hope that event supervisor didn't actually use that tiebreaker question...

cbrant554
Member
Member
Posts: 124
Joined: April 21st, 2018, 11:57 am
Division: C
State: IN
Location: VHS

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by cbrant554 » January 13th, 2019, 5:44 pm

UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F wrote:
kate! wrote:
UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F wrote: It is true that birds are part of the same clade as reptiles, but Reptilia is not a clade: it is a class. The clade that includes reptiles and birds is generally (read: as far as I know) called Sauropsida. Either way, it doesn't make sense for a bird to be on the Herpetology List because herpetologists don't study birds.
Also, Ornithology is literally an event so why would there be birds in any other event.
Yeah, I hope that event supervisor didn't actually use that tiebreaker question...
The Question was a whole separate question from the others and was labeled tiebreaker. The person who wrote the test wasn't a "Official test writer" they just volunteered and had done ecology before. Luckily it was only an invite

UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F
Exalted Member
Exalted Member
Posts: 1518
Joined: January 18th, 2015, 7:42 am
Division: C
State: PA

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F » January 13th, 2019, 5:54 pm

cbrant554 wrote:
UTF-8 U+6211 U+662F wrote:
kate! wrote: Also, Ornithology is literally an event so why would there be birds in any other event.
Yeah, I hope that event supervisor didn't actually use that tiebreaker question...
The Question was a whole separate question from the others and was labeled tiebreaker. The person who wrote the test wasn't a "Official test writer" they just volunteered and had done ecology before. Luckily it was only an invite
Haha, props to the test writer for volunteering!

anthony
Member
Member
Posts: 1
Joined: January 16th, 2019, 2:37 pm

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by anthony » January 16th, 2019, 2:40 pm

:D :( :x :lol: :shock: :? :geek: 8-) :!:
Are we allowed to use a published field guide in the herpetology event? If so, what's the best one?

User avatar
emmalasagna
Member
Member
Posts: 40
Joined: April 8th, 2018, 11:30 am
Division: C
State: CT

Re: Herpetology B/C

Post by emmalasagna » January 16th, 2019, 4:32 pm

anthony wrote: Are we allowed to use a published field guide in the herpetology event? If so, what's the best one?
As of the new rules for this year, only a student-made binder is allowed for competitions. Field guides can still be useful for gathering information and studying, though (Peterson's field guides are usually recommended), but aren't allowed in competitions.
bedford ms '19, staples hs '23
ornithology, fossils, designer genes, expd

please bring back herp like actually please

Post Reply

Return to “2019 Study Events”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests