2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

We're looking forward to the tournament at North Carolina State!
Godspeed
Member
Member
Posts: 75
Joined: February 20th, 2020, 10:16 pm
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by Godspeed » March 13th, 2020, 7:57 pm

pb5754 wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 7:29 pm
knightmoves wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 6:53 pm
SilverBreeze wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 3:11 pm
At Troy, most people that try out don't end up on A or B team, so they don't go to any invites. We don't take everyone that tries out/applies, and same for many (most that I know of?) high schools and middle schools. It's just not feasible to have 4+ teams when, as Umaroth mentioned in YRDC or elsewhere I think, most of them won't make the A team even by senior year. So at some schools that makes sense, but for many just the tryout isn't going to provide much experience.
To be fair, that's a choice. There are plenty of schools that do have 4 teams, and send them to invites. Sometimes, all 4 teams go, sometimes just a couple of teams go, and depending on the quality of the invite, it might be the top teams or it might not be.

It depends what your school wants scioly to be. If you're all about the A team, and your only goal is to develop a team to win Nationals, then you're right - you don't have any interest in people that aren't potential future A team members. But that's a choice. You might have some solid C-team people who are never going to make the A-team, but nevertheless have a good experience competing in a couple of lesser invites. Scioly can be for them too - it doesn't have to be just for the elites. It's a choice.
tbh unless you live somewhere where there are a bunch of instate tournaments (eg. Ohio) or you have the money to attend a lot of more distant comps, i feel like it's hard to be able to have more than 3 teams while also being able to adequately prepare/develop the A/B teams for the current/future seasons.
We have 6 teams and all 6 placed in the top 13 of our regional.

Godspeed
Member
Member
Posts: 75
Joined: February 20th, 2020, 10:16 pm
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 6 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by Godspeed » March 13th, 2020, 8:00 pm

sciolyperson1 wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 7:36 pm
pb5754 wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 7:29 pm
knightmoves wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 6:53 pm


To be fair, that's a choice. There are plenty of schools that do have 4 teams, and send them to invites. Sometimes, all 4 teams go, sometimes just a couple of teams go, and depending on the quality of the invite, it might be the top teams or it might not be.

It depends what your school wants scioly to be. If you're all about the A team, and your only goal is to develop a team to win Nationals, then you're right - you don't have any interest in people that aren't potential future A team members. But that's a choice. You might have some solid C-team people who are never going to make the A-team, but nevertheless have a good experience competing in a couple of lesser invites. Scioly can be for them too - it doesn't have to be just for the elites. It's a choice.
tbh unless you live somewhere where there are a bunch of instate tournaments (eg. Ohio) or you have the money to attend a lot of more distant comps, i feel like it's hard to be able to have more than 3 teams while also being able to adequately prepare/develop the A/B teams for the current/future seasons.
San Deigo regionals though :?:
Yessir, I believe that Oak Valley, Carmel Valley, Pacific Trails, Black Mountain, and Marshall all have 6 teams each. We had 45 teams this year, and 30 of those teams come from these 5 schools

knightmoves
Member
Member
Posts: 280
Joined: April 26th, 2018, 6:40 pm
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 8 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by knightmoves » March 13th, 2020, 8:39 pm

SilverBreeze wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 7:39 pm
True, but where are the coaches and parents to keep an eye on everyone? Captains and parents are exhausted arranging everything as is.
The number of parents scales with the number of competitors.

I'll agree with you that 60+ people looks different from 30+ people when it comes to organizing events, but having 60+ people in a program is hardly unprecedented in high schools. Plenty of high school football programs have more kids than that.
SciOly isn't just for the elites, but what about the 20ish people that only try out for Anatomy and Physiology and no other event? Are you going to allow people that won't put in any time toward studying and will probably ditch many if not most invites, but you need to make room for them in all your arrangements?
There's a difference between people who are interested and willing to put in the effort, but just aren't as smart as your top people, and people who don't want to put much effort in. I'll agree with you that people who don't bother to study and ditch invites aren't interested in competition, and if you try to put them on a team, everyone's going to end up unhappy. But just as there are plenty of people who enjoy competitive sport, even though they're not that good, people can enjoy competitive science even though they don't have a hope of getting near your A team.

I'm not trying to attack Troy, or tell you that the choices your school makes are wrong. I'm just pointing out that they are exactly that - choices. And there are a number of other schools that run 3 or 4 teams, so it can clearly be done. Does having that many teams damage your A team? I don't know.

User avatar
Umaroth
Member
Member
Posts: 238
Joined: February 10th, 2018, 8:51 pm
Division: C
State: CA
Pronouns: He/Him/His
Location: Pretend hugging SIlverBreeze because social distancing
Has thanked: 36 times
Been thanked: 83 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by Umaroth » March 13th, 2020, 9:04 pm

knightmoves wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 8:39 pm
I'm not trying to attack Troy, or tell you that the choices your school makes are wrong. I'm just pointing out that they are exactly that - choices. And there are a number of other schools that run 3 or 4 teams, so it can clearly be done. Does having that many teams damage your A team? I don't know.
I wasn't there that year, but from what I know, when Kraemer fielded 5 teams in my seventh grade year, we had a lot of problems with the other teams distracting the main A team competitors. The majority of them ended up quitting the next year and we only had three the next year with a lot of seventh graders.
Troy SciOly 2019-now
The Ambassador

Proud Kraemer SciOly Padre 2018-now
Dank Memes Area Homeschool Juggernaut 2018-now
Kraemer SciOly Pretty-Much Head Coach 2019-now
2020 Tryouts: Circuit, Code, Detector, DP, GeoMaps, Machines
States Events: HANDS ON DISEASE DETECTIVES

Umaroth's Userpage

User avatar
SilverBreeze
Member
Member
Posts: 217
Joined: November 28th, 2019, 3:42 pm
Division: C
State: CA
Pronouns: She/Her/Hers
Location: Pretend hugging Umaroth because social distancing
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 86 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by SilverBreeze » March 13th, 2020, 9:24 pm

I think it depends on how many coaches and parents you have and how much time each coach/parent feels they should be putting into each team. Distractions are a major concern, and team practices with 60ish students sound like a nightmare. Given that a lot of coaches/parents are sleep-deprived as is from teaching/parenting/helping out/etc., I don't think it's feasible for us to expand our numbers without less time/effort being put into each team.
Troy SciOly 2019 - now
Suzanne SciOly 2016 - 2019
Please don’t replay rules next year.
Events this season: Water Quality, Forensics, Ornithology, (some experience in DP)

User avatar
EwwPhysics
Member
Member
Posts: 92
Joined: February 22nd, 2020, 12:38 pm
Division: B
State: PA
Pronouns: She/Her/Hers
Location: Seattle!
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 35 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by EwwPhysics » March 14th, 2020, 8:19 am

SilverBreeze wrote:
March 13th, 2020, 9:24 pm
I think it depends on how many coaches and parents you have and how much time each coach/parent feels they should be putting into each team. Distractions are a major concern, and team practices with 60ish students sound like a nightmare. Given that a lot of coaches/parents are sleep-deprived as is from teaching/parenting/helping out/etc., I don't think it's feasible for us to expand our numbers without less time/effort being put into each team.
Please note that I’m not saying that one way is better than another, just that it is possible to have a good team without tryouts (we came in 3rd at PA states last year, for reference)
Because we meet 4 times a week once competition season starts, only about 20-30 people come to each practice.
Also, we’re not split into A and B teams at the beginning of the year, which imo gives more motivation for people to improve if they’re not the best at the beginning of the season. We do start stacking at our second invitational, but the teams always change between then and regionals, and between regionals and states.
Basically, no less effort has to be put into a team because, except at competition, we’re not split into teams, so the focus is more on the individual rather than the team.
Also, except at competitions, coaches don’t have to do very much. It’s on the students to learn and become good at our events. We usually just have 1 coach at each meeting to supervise and help answer our questions if we ask (which we honestly hardly do >w<).

Again, I’m not hating on Troy or anything, just pointing out that this is possible.
These users thanked the author EwwPhysics for the post:
AlfWeg (March 14th, 2020, 9:47 am)
Bala Cynwyd Middle School Class of '20 --> Lower Merion High School Class of '24

2021 events:
Designer Genes
Fossils
[Protein and/or Disease]
Possibly Botany (trial)
Heredity  (we <3 genetics!)
Fossils :D
WIDI (no comment)
Circuit :/

User avatar
bernard
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 2141
Joined: January 5th, 2014, 3:12 pm
Division: Grad
State: WA
Pronouns: He/Him/His
Location: Seattle, WA
Has thanked: 95 times
Been thanked: 228 times
Contact:

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by bernard » March 14th, 2020, 2:08 pm

bernard wrote:
March 14th, 2020, 2:08 pm
Throughout the outbreak, the national Science Olympiad organization has proactively provided guidance to state and tournament directors with recommendations to follow advice of health authorities and prioritize the "health and safety of all involved," sample statements for possible cancellation scenarios, and updates from the national level.

I've uploaded (with permission) correspondence from the national organization on February 28, March 5, and March 11 to the 2019-20 Coronavirus outbreak Wiki.
These users thanked the author bernard for the post:
CookiePie1 (March 14th, 2020, 2:57 pm)
"One of the ways that I believe people express their appreciation to the rest of humanity is to make something wonderful and put it out there."

hcho0014
Member
Member
Posts: 2
Joined: April 12th, 2019, 11:12 pm
Division: C
State: CA
Has thanked: 0
Been thanked: 0

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by hcho0014 » March 14th, 2020, 5:27 pm

What do you guys feel about the replay of the events for next year lol?

pb5754
Member
Member
Posts: 464
Joined: March 5th, 2017, 7:49 pm
Division: C
State: NJ
Pronouns: He/Him/His
Has thanked: 17 times
Been thanked: 30 times

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by pb5754 » March 14th, 2020, 5:34 pm

hcho0014 wrote:
March 14th, 2020, 5:27 pm
What do you guys feel about the replay of the events for next year lol?
viewtopic.php?f=334&t=17370
These users thanked the author pb5754 for the post:
builderguy135 (March 14th, 2020, 5:53 pm)
West Windsor-Plainsboro High School South '21

twig
Member
Member
Posts: 77
Joined: January 12th, 2020, 8:39 am
Division: B
State: CA
Pronouns: She/Her/Hers
Location: MPR, Room 2, Music Room, somewhere where I'm stressing out from Scioly
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 0

Re: 2020 National Tournament: North Carolina State University

Post by twig » March 16th, 2020, 9:06 am

In my honest opinion, coaches are not what makes the team strong itself...
It's about the motivation and dedication that the students have to do the events. My team as well doesn't have tryouts and we only get one day a week (Saturday) because most of the coaches are busy with the real world. This year has been one of our strongest years...except for that one year that we got an overall score of 32 at regionals[(don't know if he was lying) For example, our water quality coach is actually an ecologist and he does this for a living. We let anyone in because they want the learning experience even if they don't get an opportunity to compete or if their parents force them in. I joined Scioly because of pure interest, but I didn't know what it would take to win. Now I'm a coach... who knew that I would be one haha. Even as a coach, I would have to say that my students are way too reliant on me, and I keep telling them this. "If you really want to make A team or go to states with all of us, you'll need to work hard in order to get there. I can always help you along the way... but you're on your own." I also tell them to stop nagging me as well...
I might even become captain next year because of what I have done to help the team and my bonds with almost everyone except a couple of them, that's nice to know <3

Yes, it's super unfair to the partner who is consistently working really hard on scioly, while the other partner is doing who knows what... Exactly my situation this year. That's why I've was telling my partners to work harder because I'm was sick of carrying them at almost every single comp. Now, I guess I'll have to solo everything, and that's totally fine with me. :)
2021 events: Fossils, DP, Meteo, Code, Road Scholar, Orni
2018-2021: Non-proud member of DMSO
2019-2024: co-coach of Meteorology, coach for Crime Busters,co-coach for Fossils,co-coach for R&M, co-coach for DP
A very non-intelligent crackhead during competition

Post Reply

Return to “Nationals”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests