Score Discussion

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sciolyperson1
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Score Discussion

Postby sciolyperson1 » October 17th, 2018, 3:32 pm

National Placement Predictions:

1) 80 gap
3) 70 gap
6) 65 gap
10) 55 gap
15) 50 gap
20) 45 gap
WW-P HSN '22

Roller Coaster National Champion '19
Team (Nats) - 3rd '18, '19
Mystery - 3rd '19
Buggy - 4th '19, 5th '18
Mission - 3rd '17



'20: Gravity - Boomi - WIDI - PPP? - Detector? - Wright?

Rate my tests!

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IvanGe
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby IvanGe » October 18th, 2018, 6:08 pm

National Placement Predictions:

1) 80 gap
3) 70 gap
6) 65 gap
10) 55 gap
15) 50 gap
20) 45 gap
I'm pretty sure time is weighted equally as the gap score is(correct me if I'm wrong), so you can't just base everything off of the gap score. People with better timing strategies could beat people who have higher gap scores and lower time calculation.
gelinas 2016-2019, wmhs'22

nats '19:
5th - potions
5th - fossils
9th - buggy

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sciolyperson1
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby sciolyperson1 » October 18th, 2018, 7:00 pm

National Placement Predictions:

1) 80 gap
3) 70 gap
6) 65 gap
10) 55 gap
15) 50 gap
20) 45 gap
I'm pretty sure time is weighted equally as the gap score is(correct me if I'm wrong), so you can't just base everything off of the gap score. People with better timing strategies could beat people who have higher gap scores and lower time calculation.
You're correct.
I forgot to add that I think the top medallists would get a maximum of 5 seconds off. Top 10 would get maybe 10-15 seconds off, and top 20 would get about 20 seconds off.
WW-P HSN '22

Roller Coaster National Champion '19
Team (Nats) - 3rd '18, '19
Mystery - 3rd '19
Buggy - 4th '19, 5th '18
Mission - 3rd '17



'20: Gravity - Boomi - WIDI - PPP? - Detector? - Wright?

Rate my tests!

builder83
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby builder83 » November 5th, 2018, 8:43 am

After messing around with the coaster quite a bit, there is no way with the smaller dimensions anybody will be close to 80. Especially with the time constraints. I would assume most competitive coasters will have the ability to both jumps and time. If not, they are just guessing and hoping for judges to pick a time that works for a single coaster. Its not like you can just burn a 60 second halfpipe or funnel or ramp a few cm of height.

So my guess is the winner will have the capacity to do 50 cm in jumps OR up to 60 seconds in time (with some jumps) or combinations by adjusting the track. The increased time factor and such a range of time will be much more of a problem to solve than last year when time was mostly ignored.

Whats your best time staller?
National Placement Predictions:

1) 80 gap
3) 70 gap
6) 65 gap
10) 55 gap
15) 50 gap
20) 45 gap
I'm pretty sure time is weighted equally as the gap score is(correct me if I'm wrong), so you can't just base everything off of the gap score. People with better timing strategies could beat people who have higher gap scores and lower time calculation.
You're correct.
I forgot to add that I think the top medallists would get a maximum of 5 seconds off. Top 10 would get maybe 10-15 seconds off, and top 20 would get about 20 seconds off.

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IvanGe
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby IvanGe » November 5th, 2018, 4:54 pm

After messing around with the coaster quite a bit, there is no way with the smaller dimensions anybody will be close to 80. Especially with the time constraints. I would assume most competitive coasters will have the ability to both jumps and time. If not, they are just guessing and hoping for judges to pick a time that works for a single coaster. Its not like you can just burn a 60 second halfpipe or funnel or ramp a few cm of height.

So my guess is the winner will have the capacity to do 50 cm in jumps OR up to 60 seconds in time (with some jumps) or combinations by adjusting the track. The increased time factor and such a range of time will be much more of a problem to solve than last year when time was mostly ignored.

Whats your best time staller?

I'm pretty sure time is weighted equally as the gap score is(correct me if I'm wrong), so you can't just base everything off of the gap score. People with better timing strategies could beat people who have higher gap scores and lower time calculation.
You're correct.
I forgot to add that I think the top medallists would get a maximum of 5 seconds off. Top 10 would get maybe 10-15 seconds off, and top 20 would get about 20 seconds off.
I'm not doing rollercoaster this year (bc I got 7th at Nats) but the probable best time staller is half pipes. They will stall for a pretty long time if they are bent right and used properly.
gelinas 2016-2019, wmhs'22

nats '19:
5th - potions
5th - fossils
9th - buggy

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sciolyperson1
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby sciolyperson1 » November 5th, 2018, 6:25 pm

After messing around with the coaster quite a bit, there is no way with the smaller dimensions anybody will be close to 80. Especially with the time constraints. I would assume most competitive coasters will have the ability to both jumps and time. If not, they are just guessing and hoping for judges to pick a time that works for a single coaster. Its not like you can just burn a 60 second halfpipe or funnel or ramp a few cm of height.

So my guess is the winner will have the capacity to do 50 cm in jumps OR up to 60 seconds in time (with some jumps) or combinations by adjusting the track. The increased time factor and such a range of time will be much more of a problem to solve than last year when time was mostly ignored.

Whats your best time staller?

You're correct.
I forgot to add that I think the top medallists would get a maximum of 5 seconds off. Top 10 would get maybe 10-15 seconds off, and top 20 would get about 20 seconds off.
I'm not doing rollercoaster this year (bc I got 7th at Nats) but the probable best time staller is half pipes. They will stall for a pretty long time if they are bent right and used properly.
Good idea, but they take up a lot of height and are sometimes not consistent. The other option is a controlled sloped ramp, which may be consistent, and take up only a smal bit of height.

Either type has its own pros and cons; I would suggest the half pipes if you're not as experienced.
WW-P HSN '22

Roller Coaster National Champion '19
Team (Nats) - 3rd '18, '19
Mystery - 3rd '19
Buggy - 4th '19, 5th '18
Mission - 3rd '17



'20: Gravity - Boomi - WIDI - PPP? - Detector? - Wright?

Rate my tests!

cbrant554
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby cbrant554 » November 21st, 2018, 10:49 pm

After messing around with the coaster quite a bit, there is no way with the smaller dimensions anybody will be close to 80. Especially with the time constraints. I would assume most competitive coasters will have the ability to both jumps and time. If not, they are just guessing and hoping for judges to pick a time that works for a single coaster. Its not like you can just burn a 60 second halfpipe or funnel or ramp a few cm of height.

So my guess is the winner will have the capacity to do 50 cm in jumps OR up to 60 seconds in time (with some jumps) or combinations by adjusting the track. The increased time factor and such a range of time will be much more of a problem to solve than last year when time was mostly ignored.

Whats your best time staller?
I'm not doing rollercoaster this year (bc I got 7th at Nats) but the probable best time staller is half pipes. They will stall for a pretty long time if they are bent right and used properly.
Good idea, but they take up a lot of height and are sometimes not consistent. The other option is a controlled sloped ramp, which may be consistent, and take up only a smal bit of height.

Either type has its own pros and cons; I would suggest the half pipes if you're not as experienced.
I think that first place at Nats will be a risky high 60 or low 70 cm on jumps and less than 3 seconds off time

jander14indoor
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby jander14indoor » January 18th, 2019, 11:24 am

I ran the Centerville invitational last weekend and have some comments for your information.
General comment to put this in perspective. It is an early invitational, I expect improvement to come, some teams sandbagging, etc. BUT, it had some of the top Ohio and Michigan Middle schools in attendance. Solon, Meads Mill, Magsig, etc. Though of course past performance is not guarantee of future performance.

Subjective, high level comments, no numbers, no hows.
First, mixed strategies (as intended by the points adjustments) were more successful.
Winning team had excellent gap and good (left 20 points behind) time score, no attempt at height.
Second place had the best gap score, but no attempt at height or time scores.
Third team had NO gap score, but near best height (lowest) and time (closest to target) scores.
Fourth team had very good gap and almost perfect time.
Fifth team again had NO gap score, but near best height and very good time score.

BE CAREFUL of device dimensions. Top scoring device was second tiered. It was not the only otherwise very good device that was tiered.
Consistency was better this year, construction was better. Much less paper, cheap, but not reliable.

MY general conclusions.
Up through regionals, a low device and accurate time can be very competitive. Maybe even in some states. It will return a respectable result in many states.
Competitive states will require good gap and good time scores to win.
Nationals will require excellent gap AND time scores this year (unless the target is VERY low), possibly try for some height score, but only if it doesn't cost gap.

Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI

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sciolyperson1
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby sciolyperson1 » January 20th, 2019, 2:23 pm

I ran the Centerville invitational last weekend and have some comments for your information.
General comment to put this in perspective. It is an early invitational, I expect improvement to come, some teams sandbagging, etc. BUT, it had some of the top Ohio and Michigan Middle schools in attendance. Solon, Meads Mill, Magsig, etc. Though of course past performance is not guarantee of future performance.

Subjective, high level comments, no numbers, no hows.
First, mixed strategies (as intended by the points adjustments) were more successful.
Winning team had excellent gap and good (left 20 points behind) time score, no attempt at height.
Second place had the best gap score, but no attempt at height or time scores.
Third team had NO gap score, but near best height (lowest) and time (closest to target) scores.
Fourth team had very good gap and almost perfect time.
Fifth team again had NO gap score, but near best height and very good time score.

BE CAREFUL of device dimensions. Top scoring device was second tiered. It was not the only otherwise very good device that was tiered.
Consistency was better this year, construction was better. Much less paper, cheap, but not reliable.

MY general conclusions.
Up through regionals, a low device and accurate time can be very competitive. Maybe even in some states. It will return a respectable result in many states.
Competitive states will require good gap and good time scores to win.
Nationals will require excellent gap AND time scores this year (unless the target is VERY low), possibly try for some height score, but only if it doesn't cost gap.

Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI
How much gap did 2nd place get?
WW-P HSN '22

Roller Coaster National Champion '19
Team (Nats) - 3rd '18, '19
Mystery - 3rd '19
Buggy - 4th '19, 5th '18
Mission - 3rd '17



'20: Gravity - Boomi - WIDI - PPP? - Detector? - Wright?

Rate my tests!

jander14indoor
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Re: Score Discussion

Postby jander14indoor » January 20th, 2019, 7:52 pm

That would be a specific design number, I'm told I shouldn't quote those as an event supervisor vice a competitor...
Ask me end of season when it can't affect competition.

Jeff Anderson
Livonia, MI


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